Costco Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel Challenge! (Kirkland wines vs. similarly priced wines)

Show Notes

Episode 128: Costco Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel Challenge!  00:00

Hi Everyone! And welcome to The Wine Pair Podcast. I’m Joe, your sommelier of reasonably priced wine, and this is my wife and my wine pairing partner in crime, Carmela. And we are The Wine Pair! 

If you are new to our podcast, here is a quick orientation! Each week, we explore a different wine varietal or blend—like Pinot Noir or Bordeaux or Old Vine Zinfandel — and dive into what makes it unique, special,and worth learning about. Our goal is to help you expand your wine knowledge in a fun way that normal people can understand. We also taste and review 2-3 wines under $20 each, and share our scores and recommendations to help you find great wines without breaking the bank. So, thank you so much for joining us; we promise it will be worth your time! And, we are proud to say that Decanter Magazine calls us fun, irreverent, chatty, and entertaining.

Ok, Carmela, we are back with one of our favorite episode series and that is our Costco Kirkland Signature Wine Challenge where we find a Kirkland Signature wine at Costco and compare it to two other similarly priced wines and see how the old Kirkland Signature stacks up. Because, afterall, it is very tempting to pick up a bottle of wine or twenty when we’re at Costco, and because the price points of the Signature wines are so low, and because we often do not know who is actually producing the wine, we can be unsure about how good the wine actually is and if it is worth it.

And that is what we are going to solve for you today out there in listening land. Today, as we mentioned in the introduction we are focusing on the Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel. Now, we’ll talk about what exactly an Old Vine Zinfandel is in a couple of minutes, but before we do that, I want to talk about how you might know if you even like Zinfandel in the first place. 

Which can be part of the challenge. I mean, not only do you want to know if the Kirkland Signature wine is any good, you want to know if the wine itself is something you want to spend money on, which can be hard to do if you are really not sure what the wine is in the first place. 

I will remind you all that I do have a handy-dandy chart in the Blog on our website where I put together some thoughts on wines you might want to try based on other wines you like. The way the chart works, and it is all based on red wines, is that I grouped together wines that have similar taste profiles, acidity, body, and tannins, so you can make a decent guess that if you like one wine with that profile or something similar, you might find another that is similar that you might like as well. It’s not perfect, but it should help. 

So, Zinfandel tends to be a big bodied wine with relatively low acid, high tannins, high alcohol, and a flavor profile of red and black berries. I find that, for a low acid wine, Zinfandel tends to go well with food, particularly red meat and rich Italian foods, and that is because the high alcohol in the wine balances out the tannins, and the lighter berry flavor makes it not feel so overpowering. One of our favorite wines is the Turley Zinfandels from Paso Robles in California, and those are generally all Old Vine Zins. I find them really juicy and rich, but extremely smooth. Not a punch you in the face wine. 

Some wines that can be similar to Zinfandel are Grenache or Grenache based red wines, particularly GSM blends, and also Priorat which is a Spanish wine from Catalonia that we did an episode on a few weeks ago and is considered one of the great wines of Spain. Some people say Negroamaro, and I would also suggest Malbec or Cabernet Franc. Of course there is also Primitivo which is the same grape as Zinfandel but grown in the Puglia region of Italy. So, if you like those wines, you might like Zinfandel, and if you like Zinfandel, you might like those wines. 

However, I think that is enough on that subject because we need to learn a little more about what Old Vine Zinfandel actually means, and we have two Old Vine Zinfandels we are going to taste test along side the Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel to see if it is worth buying the next time you are at Costco . . 

But first . . . we have to do our shameless plug.

Thank you for listening to us and for supporting our show, and if you haven’t  had the chance to do so yet, now would be the perfect time to subscribe to our podcast  - it is a free way to support us, and then you never have to miss a show!  - and a huge thank you to all of you who have subscribed already! 

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You can also follow us and see pictures of the wines we are tasting and trying today on Instagram at thewinepairpodcast, and you can contact us on our website thewinepairpodcast.com, and you can sign up for our email newsletter there and get news and food and wine pairing ideas and more!

And we want to make content you care about and you like, so send us a note and tell us what you like and don’t like, if there are wines you want us to try or wine making areas of the world you are curious about - and we’ll take care of it!

And by the way, coincidentally, last week we got a really nice DM on Instagram from Wendy who was asking us what we thought about the Costco Barolo because her Costco had just gotten some back in stock, so at the end of the episode, we’ll answer that question if you want to hear about it. 

And, as we do every week, we’ll tell you someone we think you should recommend The Wine Pair Podcast to so we can keep growing listeners. This week, we want you to recommend us to anyone who loves to buy wine at Costco but can’t seem to get past the stupid Cabernet and Chardonnay choices they keep making! You know who they are!

ARTICLES and LINKS

• https://www.wtso.com/blog/wine-comparisons-if-you-like-this-drink-that/
• https://thewinepairpodcast.com/blog/handy-chart-to-help-you-find-wines-similar-to-ones-you-like 

Topic: WTF is Old Vine Zinfandel? 07:58

So, let’s talk about just what the F an Old Vine Zinfandel is. Because Old Vine seems like something that you mostly hear about when it comes to Zinfandel. I don’t hear a lot of people talking about old vine Cabernet Sauvignon or old vine Sauvignon Blanc. Do you?!?

So, first of all, to be considered an Old Vine Zinfandel, the vines are supposed to be at least 50 years old. Which I know at first blush seems like that’s pretty old, but let’s just say 50 years requires some perspective. For instance, the distance between 20’s and 70’s was 50 years. That’s just math. But 50 years ago today was the 70’s and maybe I am just an old vine myself, but that doesn’t seem super long ago. 

Now, I caveated it by saying the vines should be or are supposed to be at least 50 years old, but there is actually no law or legal requirement for what counts as an Old Vine Zinfadel. According to an article I used for some research, the Alcohol and Tobacco Trade Bureau did try to create some rules, but nothing really stuck. Suffice it to say that legitimate winemakers will be using vines that are at least 50 years old, and some use vines that are much older than that. 

Old Vine Zinfandel is kind of a California thing, too. The first Zinfandel vines are supposed to have shown up in California during the Gold Rush in the 1800’s, and supposedly some of the vines that were planted at that time are still producing grapes. And California makes a lot of Zinfandel. After Chardonnay and Cabernet Sauvignon, Zinfandel is the third most produced wine grape variety in the state. So, they are making a lot of Zin, and old Zin, in California. 

But the question is, who cares? I mean, what makes Old Vine Zinfandel so special anyway? What does it got that I ain’t got?!?

Well, for one thing, older vines produce less fruit, and that means that the fruit they do create is more concentrated, and therefore more flavorful. So, these Old Vines are producing some good juice! For another, there are some wine grape vines that just don’t produce well when they get old. But Zinfandel can produce a good amount of wine even past 100 years old. Which is saying something. 

Zinfandel also tolerates heat well and doesn’t need a lot of water, so it does great in a climate like California’s Central Coast where it is most famously grown. And another thing about those Old Vines is that they take a lot of care - the vines are low to the ground and they grow in tight clusters so farming them is evidently backbreaking work which favors more hands-on than machinery-led, so the grapes are well cared for by the time they are brought to harvest. 

A few additional notes about Zinfandel. Again, it is the same grape that is called Primitivo in Italy, and so if you like this wine, you will probably like that wine. And I would avoid buying mass produced Zinfandels if you can help it. Try to find Old Vine Zinfandels that are made by smaller producers. You’ll likely find they are better quality. One of our lowest rated wines of all time was the 7 Deadly Zins Old Vine Zinfandel which is easy to find but not worth buying and should be avoided at all costs. 

And finally, just note that Zinfandels tend to be high in alcohol, and the good ones can be very high in alcohol, and that is a good thing from a body and taste standpoint, but it can also put you on your lips if you are not careful. A moderately alcohol Zin will be in the 14.5% range. So don’t say we didn’t warn you!

But, on that note, I think it’s time to learn a little more about the specific wines we are drinking today. Whaddya say?

ARTICLES and LINKS

• https://www.vinovest.co/blog/old-vine-zinfandel#:~:text=Old%20Vine%20Zinfandel%20is%20any,Old%20Vine%E2%80%9D%20for%20marketing%20purposes. 
• https://vinepair.com/articles/what-is-old-vine-zinfandel/ 
• https://wineinstitute.org/our-industry/statistics/wine-fact-sheets/zinfandel/ 
• https://napavalleywineacademy.com/california-zinfandel-past-present-future/ 

Old Vine Zinfandel Wines We Chose for This Episode 14:06

As usual, all of the wines we have chosen for this episode are under $20, and all of them should be relatively easy to find because I bought the Costco wine at Costco, which may surprise you, and I bought the other two at wine.com. I will say that finding Zinfandel, and Old Vine Zinfandel is not hard. What is hard is finding Zinfandels that are good, because some of them are shit. 

All of the wines we bought today are very reasonably priced at $12.99 or less, and the non-Costco wines have good ratings from professional raters that are not James Suckling, and so we feel pretty confident that we have at least tried to give it a good go to help you find an Old Vine Zinfandel you will like. Even the Costco wine has had good reviews in the past, and some of the wine sites that specialize in Costco wines also like it. 

The first wine we are going to drink is the Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel, and it is from 2021. The Reverse Wine Snob gave it an 8 and the Costco Wine Blog gave it an 87, lower than previous vintages, but still pretty good scores.

The winemaker is actually named on the bottle, which is becoming a bit more common on Kirkland Signature wines because it seems that Costco wines have a good reputation, and so the tendency for winemakers to want to pretend like they don’t make white labeled wines is not sticking with Costco because they probably figure they can get some good publicity. 

The winemaker is Zach Long, and te also makes wines with his wife for their own Jonas Cellars and I believe he still makes wines for Kunde Family Winery. 

Interestingly, this wine is made from grapes from Sonoma, and the other two are from Lodi. And so, on that note, because there is not a lot else I can tell you about the Costco wine, let’s move to our next wine.

The next wine is 2022 Cline Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel and Cline is a big winemaker that you should be able to find pretty easily. I was able to find a tech sheet, which always makes me happy. 

The winery says that they ferment the wine in open-top cement tanks, and that the wine is pumped over three times a day - so they are trying to extract a lot of flavor from this wine. They also say the age for 12 months in 35% new French oak - so not sure what the rest is. But this should be a dry and oaky wine. Wine Spectator gave this wine a 90, so for its price, which is $12.99, if this wine is good, it is a steal. 

The last wine we are going to try is the 2020 Plungerhead Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel, and I like the name and love the bottle, and Wine Enthusiast also likes the wine and gave it an 89.

Interestingly, this wine is not 100% Zinfandel, but is actually 21% Petit Sirah, which is unusual. I also could not find a ton else about this wine, other than it is super high in alcohol at 15.5%. There was information on the website, but it looks like it is for their 2018 wine, and the mix of grapes is different than what Wine Enthusiast says, so I am confused. I did put a link in our show notes for it, but take it with a grain of salt. That always annoys me when a winery does not keep their information up-to-date, but you know what, I am going to just let it go.

So, I think that is enough information - let’s get to drinking and see how the Kirkland Signature wine stacks up to these similarly priced and highly rated Old Vine Zins! We’ll take a quick break and be right back. And, if you have these wines or similar wines, drink along with us!


ARTICLES and LINKS

• https://costcowineblog.com/2021-kirkland-signature-sonoma-county-old-vine-zinfandel/#:~:text=In%20the%20glass%20it%20pours,change%20from%20the%20usual%20varietals. 
• https://storage-us-gcs.bfldr.com/58t68khsh5jk9q6f9wrq79/v/1171896801/original/TECH%20SHEET%202022%20Cline%20Classics%20Old%20Vine%20Zinfandel.pdf?Expires=1719689865&KeyName=gcs-bfldr-prod&Signature=HWAVgJDmiW9Jc7F8rANnK-NcaNQ= 
• https://plungerheadwines.com/our-wines#old-vine-zinfadel 

2021 Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel, 2022 Cline Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel, 2020 Plungerhead Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel Wine Tasting, Pairing, and Review 20:05

Wine: Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel
Region: California, Sonoma County
Year: 2021
Price: $9.99
Retailer: Costco
Alcohol: 14.5%
Grapes: Zinfandel
Professional Rating: RWS 8, CWB 87

What we tasted and smelled in this Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel:

• On the nose: Raspberry, black cherry, grapey, vanilla, cinnamon, leather, pleather, waxy juice candy, licorice, candy, pepper, plum, complex
• In the mouth: Sharp (probably young), tart cherry, wood, cinnamon, camp fire, flavorful

Food to pair with this Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel: Red meat, pepperoni pizza, stew, flank steak, meat and potatoes, ribs, barbecue, smoked sausage, cheeseburger
 
As a reminder on our rating scale, we rate on a scale of 1-10, where 7 and above means that we would buy it, and 4 and below means that we are likely to pour it down the sink, and a 5 or 6 means we are likely to drink it and finish it, but we are probably not going to buy it. 

Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel Wine Rating: 

• Joe: 7/10
• Carmela: 7/10

Wine: Cline Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel (Click here to find this wine on wine.com. If you purchase on wine.com we may receive a commission)
Region: California, Lodi
Year: 2022
Price: $12.99
Retailer: wine.com
Alcohol: 14.5%
Grapes: Zinfandel
Professional Rating: WS 90

What we tasted and smelled in this Cline Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel:

• On the nose: Dark cherry, smoke, metallic, clove, orange, incense
• In the mouth: Blood orange juice, orange extract, clove, aluminum can, matchstick, too concentrated orange juice, candied orange peel

Food to pair with this Cline Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel: Pork tenderloin, chicken, pasta alfredo

Cline Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel Wine Rating: 

• Joe: 5/10
• Carmela: 6/10

Wine: Plungerhead Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel (Click here to find this wine on wine.com. If you purchase, we may receive a commission.)
Region: California, Lodi
Year: 2020
Price: $12.99
Retailer: wine.com
Alcohol: 15.5%
Grapes: 79% Zinfandel, 21% Petite Sirah
Professional Rating: WE 89

What we tasted and smelled in this Plungerhead Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel:

• On the nose: Wood, smoke, raisin, grapey, cherry, matchstick, black pepper, paprika
• In the mouth: Cherry, potpourri, grandma’s rose perfume, roses, flowers, stale

Food to pair with this Plungerhead Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel: Pizza, burger, something heavy to cover the taste of the wine


Plungerhead Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel Wine Rating: 

• Joe: 5/10
• Carmela: 5/10

Which one of these are you finishing tonight?

• Carmela: Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel
• Joe: Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel

The Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel wins the challenge!

Taste profiles expected from Old Vine Zinfandel  36:40

• General 
  • Wine Folly: Blackberry, Strawberry, Peach Preserves, Cinnamon, Sweet Tobacco
• Kirkland Signature Old Vine Zinfandel
  • Winemaker: Bright fruit, framed with baking spice and integrated oak defines this world class Zinfandel.
  • CWB: it is medium bodied and loaded with that jammy blackberry, black cherry, plum flavors you get in a good Zin. Little bit of spice towards the finish.
  • RWS: a super smooth and easy to drink Zin with perhaps a touch of residual sugar. It's a great example of a Sonoma Zin with very brambly flavors of ripe black cherry, blackberry, blueberry and cranberry. You'll also find plenty of licorice and a bit of leathery spice and vanilla in this flavorful and nicely balanced wine.
• Cline Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel
  • Winery: a great expression of fresh strawberry the varietal is known for, while at the same time possessing complex flavors of spice and vanilla. The wine has excellent balance and delivers a lot of flavor and finesse.
  • WS: A racy red that's loaded to pepper, plus vibrant and fresh cherry, sweet anise and cinnamon flavors that zip along a zesty finish
• Plungerhead Lodi Old Vine Zinfandel
  • Winemaker: Dark plum in color, with aromas of chocolate, brambly blackberries, toasted clove and sweet cinnamon welcome you to dive into the glass. The first sip bursts with fruit flavors of plum, raspberry, and pomegranate. Big in mouthfeel and flavor, this Zinfandel delivers on all points.
  • WE: easy to enjoy. Aromas and flavors are filled with both fresh and dried fruits: blackberry, black cherry, fig and prune—accented with oaky notes.

Responding to Text Messages and Questions 39:16

So let’s get to Wendy’s question and our response. And by the way, we love it when you reach out and ask questions or just want to shoot the shit, so don’t be shy!

Wendy said: Hi Joe and Carmela - I love your podcast. Enjoy listening to old episode while I cook dinner and have a glass of wine. Our Costco has Kirkland’s Barolo back in stock. I know it’s a little young but wondering what your thoughts on it are and keep those show notes coming!

I mean, what a sweet note. Thank you so much, Wendy. So what we said to Wendy is that we needed to know the vintage, but that 2019 was supposed to be a really good vintage, and 2020 and 2021 are getting good early reviews. Our rule of thumb is to wait 10 years on a Barolo and Barbaresco, and maybe 8 if you are impatient, but that you can drink earlier if it is a mediocre vintage. And you can always drink a Barolo or Barbaresco earlier, but it will taste pretty “sharp” - and by that we mean it will be a bit biting or hot with its alcohol and the tannins will not have mellowed out yet. It might hit you in the face a bit!

But again, we love getting questions, we really appreciate you so much, Wendy, and we want you all to feel good about reaching out to us!

Outro and how to find The Wine Pair Podcast 41:08

Ok, so, Carmela, it’s time for us to go, but before we do, we want to thank you very much for listening to us - and if you haven’t done so yet, now would be the perfect time to subscribe to our podcast and also a fantastic time to leave us a nice rating and review on our website or Apple podcasts or other podcast service - and it is an awesome and free way to support us and help us grow listeners.

We would also love to hear from you about a wine you would like us to taste and review. You can leave a message for us on our website thewinepairpodcast.com and you can join our email newsletter there, too, or you can always email us at joe@thewinepairpodcast.com. And tell us some things you want to hear us do, or not hear us do!

And, follow us on Instagram so you can see pictures of all of these wines we are tasting and reviewing.

Alright, with that, we are going to sign off, so thanks again, and we will see you next time. And, as we say, life is short, so stop drinking shitty wine.

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