Juliet: Great Packaging, But How’s the Wine?!?

Show Notes

Episode #240: Juliet: Great Packaging, But How’s the Wine?!?  00:00

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KEY QUESTIONS

• Is Juliet wine worth buying?
• Who makes Juliet wine?
• What does Juliet Pinot Noir taste like?
• Is premium boxed wine actually good now?
• What does Juliet Sauvignon Blanc taste like?

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Episode Overview and First Thoughts on Boxed Wine  00:32
Hello fellow star-crossed wine lovers! And welcome to The Wine Pair Podcast. I’m Joe, your sommelier of reasonably priced wine, and this is my wife and my wine pairing partner in crime, Carmela. And we are The Wine Pair! 

If you're new to our podcast, here's what we do: Every week we buy wines under $25 with our own money, taste them, and give you our brutally honest opinion on whether they're worth buying. Nobody pays us to review specific wines, we don't accept free bottles from wineries, and we're not afraid to call out a bad wine when we taste one. Decanter Magazine calls us fun, irreverent, chatty, and entertaining - so if that sounds like your vibe, welcome to our tribe of wine lovers.

The name for the tribe this week is very strategic, Carmela. Very strategic. 

Ok, Carmela, this week we are doing something I thought we would do a lot more of when we started this podcast, but we have actually not done very often, and that is tasting and reviewing boxed wine. Boxed wine is having a bit of a moment again, I guess, but it still has a reputation problem it is trying to get over with some audiences. And, we’ll talk about this in a bit, but although many “serious” wine drinkers are dubious about boxed wine, younger drinkers are actually becoming more attracted to it.

So, a few months ago I asked in our newsletter if our listeners would like to hear more about boxed wine, and we got enough responses that I feel good about doing some periodic episodes on it. We will generally focus on the boxed wines with better reputations, which also means a bit more expensive and maybe something you have to search a little harder for, and so this week we are going to be tasting and reviewing Juliet boxed wine. We will talk about them more in the next section, but before we do that, I thought we would talk a little bit about the rise of boxed wine. 

For most of us who are maybe a little on the older side, boxed wine has had a pretty lousy reputation. It was generally associated with cheap, mass-produced wine, mostly driven by producers like Franzia that were on the bottom shelf of your grocery store, and its whole appeal was that it had a very low price, often the equivalent of just a few bucks per bottle, came in large quantities, was frequently on the sweeter side, and could last for a long time once opened.

And I think part of the problem is that since boxed wine became so closely associated with cheap wine that people started to assume that any wine that came in a box must be cheap wine and not very good quality. It wasn't necessarily the box that was the problem. Kind of like screw caps. Today, some great wines come in screw caps, but the expectation has been that only cheap wine comes in bottles with screw caps. And we love love love us some screw caps. 

But, boxed win has been experiencing a kind of a renaissance in 2024, overall wine sales in the United States declined by 3.5%, while sales of boxed wine actually grew by more than 4%. Even more interesting, sales of boxed wines priced at $28 or more for a three-liter box grew by nearly 9%. That higher-priced segment alone accounted for approximately $1.6 billion in sales. So, while the wine industry as a whole has been struggling, it seems clear that there is something that is appealing about boxed wine to some audiences. 

Speaking of audiences, it looks like younger drinkers seem much more open to boxed wine than old people like us. According to a 2025 survey in the UK, nearly 60% of Gen Z responders said they were happy to drink wine from a box or can, and 57% believed the quality of boxed wine had improved. 

And there is a similar shift happening in the United States. A 2024 survey of nearly 4,000 American adults found that 40% of Gen Z respondents believed boxed wine was better for the environment, compared to just 23% of Baby Boomers. And when asked which packaging they preferred for wine, younger drinkers were more likely to choose boxed wine than older folks.

So, what we can take away from that is that younger consumers are less concerned about good wine coming in a traditional glass bottle, and are more interested in things like convenience, price, and sustainability.

And I think that's interesting because so much of the wine industry has been built around the traditional trappings of the wine industry, things like bottles, corks, labels and stuff like that. But maybe we are finding that younger drinkers don’t care about that stuff as much.

There are real, practical reasons for people becoming more favorable to boxed wind, and here are some of the reasons. Boxed wine generally costs less to package and ship, it has a lower carbon footprint glass bottles, and can stay fresh for four to six weeks after opening because the bag inside the box limits exposure to oxygen.  As we have mentioned in our episode from last year on boxed wine, boxed wine should really be called bagged wine. The box is just the container for a bag that collapses as you pour the wine, helping to keep air out and the wine fresh longer. And when you consider the price on a per-bottle basis, boxed wine can be a pretty good deal. For reference, many boxed wines come in three-liter sizes, which is equivalent to four standard bottles of wine. So, if you are paying $30 bucks for a three-liter box of wine, you are paying less than $10 a bottle. Not bad. But, just note that higher end boxed wines like we are drinking today are more expensive than that which we will get to later. 

The wine industry has also started looking more favorably at the boxed wine game. Respected wineries like Tablas Creek and Bedrock Wine Co., along with newer brands like Nomadica and Juliet that we are drinking this week, have started putting higher-quality wines into boxes. Some of these brands have also completely redesigned the packaging to make boxed wine look cooler and more appealing. And we’ll talk about this more in a minute about Juliet wine as well 

Now, none of this means that boxed wine has suddenly become universally respected, or that everything sold in a box is good. There's still plenty of inexpensive, mass-produced, pretty crummy boxed wine out there. Although we should be careful not to yuck anyone’s yum. But the perception is changing. The real question is, is it just clever marketing, or is the wine really better? 

And, on that very note, we are going to taste and review one of the more popular premium boxed wine brands that has gotten a lot of attention called Juliet, and we have two of their boxed wines to drink today, one a Sauvignon Blanc and the other a Pinot Noir, so we are going to give this wine a real shot to impress us because those are two of our favorite varietals, but also two varietals that we have high bars for, so we’ll let you know if we think they meet our bar when we drink them . . . 

But first . . . we have to do our shameless plug.

Thank you for listening to us and for supporting our show, and know that we buy all of the wine we taste and review every week so that we can give you real and honest reviews. If you like what you’re hearing, please subscribe to our podcast and leave us a five star rating and review so we can grow listeners.

We also love to hear from you and we always respond so you can follow us on Instagram and Bluesky and TikTok at thewinepairpodcast. You can contact us on our website thewinepairpodcast.com, and you can sign up for our email newsletter there and you can also send us a note at joe@thewinepairpodcast.com and let us know about wines your want us to review or just shoot the breeze, we love chatting it up.

And, as we do every week, we’ll tell you someone we think you should recommend The Wine Pair Podcast to - because the best way for us to grow listeners is when you tell your family and friends about us - and this week, we want you to recommend us to anyone who has been curious about these new, more expensive and cooler looking boxed wines but has been afraid to try them, or anyone who is a boxed wine lover or skeptic.


Topic: WTF is Juliet Boxed Wine? 13:13

Carmela, let’s find out just what the eff Juliet boxed wine is, shall we?

Now, we are going to talk about the history and current state of Juliet wine, but this is not meant to be an advertisement for them because we don’t do that kind of stuff, so we are going to see if there is any controversy or concern around the brand and wine as well. And, trust me, there is.

Juliet Wine was founded in 2021 by longtime friends Allison Luvera and Lauren De Niro Pipher who met in college, so it is not a very old company at all. Allison has achieved WSET level 2, has an MBA from Wharton, so no dummy, and worked in fashion media and luxury marketing before starting Juliet. Lauren has a background in interior design, luxury properties, and fashion PR. So, both of these women have had backgrounds in luxury and fashion, and no experience in winemaking or production. 

During the pandemic, Allison Luvera was living at her parent’s home and drank some boxed wine from the fridge. She liked aspects of the fridge wine, like keeping wine fresh longer and a lower carbon footprint from the packaging, but felt that category was missing some “chic” in its aesthetic. She and her friend Lauren De Niro spent 18 months coming up with an “affordable luxury boxed wine, including developing the brand, the wine, and the packaging.” Just know that, in the wine world, starting from scratch in 18 months is not normal, and is a very clear indication that they are not growing their own grapes. 

The packaging was actually one of their main areas of focus, and rather than settling on the common box shape, they created a 1.5 liter container (that’s 2 bottles of wine) they call the Eco-Magnum, which makes sense since a magnum is 1.5 liters or 2 bottles of wine. They based the design of the packaging on things like handbags and luxury whiskey canisters, and the current packaging includes carrying straps. For the design on the packaging, they aimed for a Mediterranean-inspired artwork and art-deco lettering. This probably goes without saying, but the packaging does seem focused on a more female audience, which is often and underserved market.

For the wine itself, they partner with a Certified California Sustainable Winery in Happy Canyon which is in the Santa Barbara / Central Coast area of California. They say the wines are made in a low-intervention style, they use the term “clean” which I am really not a fan of, and they say their wines have no artificial additives, synthetic pesticides, or added sugar. Which, as we mentioned in a recent minisode, is really just marketing speak because most wines are made without additives and added sugar, although I am not sure that can be said for inexpensive boxed wines. Their packaging is also 100% recyclable paperboard and they have  a prepaid take-back program for recycling internal plastic pouches which is kind of a great idea.

One note which bothers me a little bit, is that it was hard to find out who actually makes their wine. Clearly the founders do not because they are not winemakers. But I don’t really like the fact that we don’t know who the winemakers are. Fundamentally, this is just a white label wine brand focused on the marketing and the packaging. This doesn’t mean there is anything wrong with the wine, but me, personally, I would prefer to know the winemakers versus the marketing department.

Another thing that is kind of interesting about Juliet is their business model strategy. They started out as a mostly direct-to-consumer brand with its own online storefront. They used that as a testing ground to make sure they had a market, understood the price points customers would pay for the wine, and other things like that. Which was pretty smart. I mean, Allison Luvera did go to Wharton afterall. Once they had proven that they were a brand that customers wanted, they started some wholesale distribution, beginning in independent wine shops in New York and California and then into stores more broadly. Another smart approach.

As you might expect from the background of the founders, they had a pretty aggressive PR strategy, and, being part of a younger generation, also really focused on brand evangelists via social media. A very millennial approach to launching a brand. They were also able to get into higher end venues like luxury resorts and upscale dining spots as a way to further solidify their brand image and reach a specific kind of customer.

In terms of their current business, they are not publicly traded, which means there are a lot of things about their business that is still being built, and there are a lot of things they don’t have to disclose about how they are doing and what they are doing.

But one of the things that is interesting about Juliet is that, despite all of the attention the brand has received for its packaging, sustainability, and upscale image, the reputation of the wine itself is relatively mixed. Now, to be clear, Juliet doesn't seem to have been involved in any major controversies or scandals that we could find, but there are some questions about whether the quality of the wine lives up to all of the marketing. Like, my question is did they spend as much time on the wine itself as they did on the business strategy?

For example, Wine Enthusiast reviewed their 2021 Pinot Noir and gave it 87 points and an Editors' Choice designation. That's a good score, although the review wasn't exactly glowing which makes me wonder why it got an Editor’s Choice award. Color me skep.  Consumer Reports was even less enthusiastic about Juliet's Sauvignon Blanc. In a review of boxed wines, their tasters found the wine to be pretty unremarkable, describing it as “inoffensive” but not particularly impressive. They also questioned the value, arguing that consumers could find better Sauvignon Blanc for the same money.  That does not seem like a glowing review.

And that brings up what I think is probably the biggest question about Juliet, which is whether you are paying for better wine or clever packaging and marketing. Their wines currently sell for around $35 for a 1.5-liter package, which works out to about $17.50 per bottle which puts it squarely in the premium tier of wine. That's not an outrageous price, but it's also not cheap, and there are a lot of very good wines available at that price point. So, the question is, what are you paying for? The brand or the wine?

Now, I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with building a wine brand around beautiful packaging and a certain aesthetic. Those are all reasons someone might choose one wine over another, quite frankly. Afterall, most people buy wines based on a the label - and there are several studies that confirm this. But when you start positioning your wine as a premium product at a premium price point, it better taste like it, and that is what we are going to find out today. And, I will just repeat, this is wine we purchased ourselves as we always do with all of the wines we review, so we have no bias going in in terms of being authentic in our reviews. We have not talked with or been communicated to by anyone affiliated with Juliet wine. So, we are going to be real with you.

So, should we find out more about these wines we are drinking today?

Juliet Boxed Wines We Chose for This Episode 23:12

The wines we have chosen for this episode were $35 each, but on a per bottle basis, as we just mentioned, that comes out to $17.50, so not bad, and they should be relatively easy to find because I bought them directly on the Juliet web site. The delivery was pretty fast and easy, and the packages they came in were undamaged, so that was good. They are starting to sell more and more in stores like Costco, Whole Foods, and Total Wine, although we have not seen the here in our local versions of those stores, but they still sell about 30% of their wine directly to consumers rather than through stores. The question for me is, will they be able to hold onto quality and their “natural” approach to wine if they get much bigger. And, as far as finding them in your local wine shop, that I am not sure about, but if you ask them, I am sure they will let you know if they can source them or not. 

The first wine we are going to drink is the 2022 Juliet Sauvignon Blanc, and I could not find any professional reviews for this wine, although it has shown up on some best boxed wine lists like Food & Wine, although, remember that Consumer Reports called it inoffensive. 

There is very little information about the wine, even on the Juliet web site. They don’t even give a great sense of the tasting notes. What we can say is that the grapes come from the Central Valley of California, specifically in the Santa Ynez Valley. I will also say, for a Sauvignon Blanc, the alcohol is quite high at 13.7%

I don’t love that there are very few professional reviews of this wine, mostly because for a wine that is growing in popularity and has a very progressive PR machine, I would expect to hear more about it. I mean, they show up in a lot of magazines and interviews, but they are mostly pieces on the founders, not the wine. It makes me a little suspicious that, with all of their PR savvy, they are very careful about what they let people say and if they give free samples of the wine to reviewers. But, again, fear not, because we will give you the straight shit.

So, let’s move on to the second wine which is the 2022 Juliet Pinot Noir, and this wine is also from California’s Central Coast, this time from Edna Valley. Again, this wine is pretty high in alcohol for a Pinot Noir at 14.7%, so that makes me a little nervous that we are going to get a Cabernet Sauvignon style of Pinot Noir which is often what happens in California Pinot.  

There was, again, very little information about this wine, and I am bothered that a bigger wine company who could certainly do so has no information about how the wine is made, if it is oaked, whether they use malolactic fermentation or not, whether they ferment it in stainless steel, how long they age it before shoving it in the bag, or even how the grapes are harvested. I know most people don’t really care about that, but here is my point one more time. If you are going to claim to be a premium or higher-end and higher quality wine, you should be able to explain how your wine is made. To me, this lack of transparency is problematic because it feels purposeful. Proud winemakers like to talk about how their wine is made. Which is why I feel this is a marketing brand rather than a true wine brand. 

Sorry, I know I should not be so biased before tasting the wine, but I just have to be honest here, I for one, really don’t appreciate the opacity. I think it shows poorly, but I am not sure they care how I feel. Again, we will see if it shows up in the wine.

Alright, I think that is enough information - let’s get to drinking! We’ll take a quick break and be right back. And, if you have these wines or similar wines, drink along with us to get some participation points, which you can trade-in for free stickers. You just need to send me an email with your mailing address, and I will get those “I drink with The Wine Pair Podcast” stickers over to you!

LINKS TO SOURCES FOR THESE SPECIFIC WINES

• https://www.consumerreports.org/health/wine/best-boxed-wine-review-a6633856927/
• https://drinkjuliet.com/products/pinot-noir-2022?srsltid=AU7gw4VR60ZVoHKa5P6EcV-i1GGSARq5WMYQvGPr9EaZPXSkmbkFUlAo 

2022 Juliet Sauvignon Blanc, 2022 Juliet Pinot Noir Wine Tasting, Pairing, and Review 27:14

Wine: Juliet Sauvignon Blanc
Region: California, Santa Ynez
Vintage: 2022
Price: $35 for the equivalent of two bottles
Retailer: Juliet web site
Alcohol: 13.7%
Grapes: Sauvignon Blanc
Professional Rating: Vivino

What we tasted and smelled in this Juliet Sauvignon Blanc: 

• Color: Golden, unctuous, thick 
• On the nose: Lemon, citrus, tropical fruit, pineapple, pear, a little gasoline, alcohol, vanilla, could it be oaked?  
• In the mouth: Thin, peach, grapefruit, bitter at the end, tea-like, oaky, lemony, pithy, not crisp or refreshing, Chardonnay-like quality 

Food to pair with this Juliet Sauvignon Blanc: Ham sandwich, egg salad sando, frittata, deviled eggs, white pizza, pesto, starchy foods, garlic bread, fish and chips, french fries, fishwich
 
As a reminder on our rating scale, we rate on a scale of 1-10, with no half points, where 7 and above means that we would buy it, and 4 and below means that we are likely to pour it down the sink, and a 5 or 6 means we are likely to drink it and finish it, but we are probably not going to buy it. 

Juliet Sauvignon Blanc Wine Rating: 
Packaging gets a 10/10

• Joe: 5/10
• Carmela: 5/10

Wine: Juliet Pinot Noir
Region: California, Edna Valley
Vintage: 2023
Price: $35 for the equivalent of two bottles
Retailer: Juliet web site
Alcohol: 14.7%
Grapes: Pinot Noir
Professional Rating: Vivino

What we tasted and smelled in this Juliet Pinot Noir: 

• Color: Dark purple, grapey, almost cloudy, matte, grape juice, does not look like a Pinot Noir
• On the nose: Raisin, currant, molasses, dried cranberry, dried fruit, smoke on the swirl, rosemary, cigar box, wood, musty, musky, grapey, spicey, spiced cherry mulled wine
• In the mouth: Tastes big initially, but thins out quickly, almost doesn’t taste like wine, a grape cocktail, cherry liqueur that has been watered down, cough syrup, old cherry cordial or old liqueur, musty, a one note wine, plum jam, does not taste like a Pinot Noir

Food to pair with this Juliet Pinot Noir: Puttanesca, salty foods, squid ink pasta, smokey foods, baked ziti, barbecue ribs, saucy, sweet


Juliet Pinot Noir Wine Rating: 
Packaging gets 10/10

• Joe: 4/10
• Carmela: 4/10

Which one of these are you finishing tonight?
Carmela: Juliet Sauvignon Blanc
Joe: Juliet Sauvignon Blanc


The Test: Did we nail the taste profiles expected from Juliet Sauvignon Blanc and Juliet Pinot Noir?  45:33

• Juliet Sauvignon Blanc
  • Winery: Meyer lemon, ripe pear, honeydew melon
  • Food & Wine: Floral and lemony
• Juliet Pinot Noir
  • Winery: Red cherry, raspberry, baking spice
  • WE from the 2021 vintage: Subtle aromas of plummy fruits and toasted bread lead from the nose into a palate where simple red fruits are laced with graham cracker warmth (87)

What is our verdict on Juliet Boxed Wine? 46:19
The packaging is fantastic, the wine is not great. Love the packaging, wish we could love the wine. The did what they wanted to do. The wine packaging is great, the wine is not good. 


And now it is time to head over to our news desk so that we can cover our wine in the news this week segment.

Wine in the news this week: Top 10 wine-related baby names 47:21

• https://www.thedrinksbusiness.com/2026/10/top-10-wine-related-baby-names/ 

Our wine in the news this week comes from James Bayley writing for The Drinks Business, and the article is called “Top 10 wine-related baby names.” And I have to say, after two weeks in a row of Italian wine thefts, I thought we should go in a bit of a lighter direction. And, the links to this article and all of the articles we use for research are in the show notes as always.

So here’s the scoop. The folks at The Drinks Business went through the government records of every baby name registered in England and Wales from 1996 to 2025, which was about 40,000 different names, and pulled out the ones that looked like they were inspired by wine. Most of the names were names for girls and the popularity of using wine inspired names is getting bigger each year. 

Carmela, any guesses on the top names? 

• Margaux (922)
• Chardonnay (631) with six different spellings
• Sherry (also Sherrie, Sherri)
• Shiraz - which is evidently a boy’s name
• Tawny
• Cristal
• Syrah
• Tuscany (a bit of a stretch)
• Petrus (also a boy’s name)
• Tie: Champagne, Dionysus, Mimosa, Morgon, Rioja

Evidently, they had to make some judgment calls along the way, so Rose was left out because it is probably about the flower, and Brandy was cut because it is a spirit, not a wine. I respect the rules, but I am not sure the Brandys of the world would agree.

So, Carmela, if we were to have named one of our kids after a wine or a spirit, what do you think we would have chosen?

Just a side note, on our wine in the news article from last week, more news has come out that the alarms were turned off from inside the building the day before the robbery, which is so sus, and the winery said that their insurance will not cover a loss that big, which is just terrible.


Listener Shoutouts 50:13

• Janyne: My husband and I wanted a glass of wine with dinner and our dinner was Ethiopian chicken.  What to pair with that? 🤔  We settled on a Durif Shiraz blend.  I wanted a reminder about Durif so I googled it.  Guess who the AI response referenced?  Yup, a podcast that I listen to called The Wine Pair. So your intellectual property has been sucked up.  I'm sure you have been generously compensated.
• Chef Paul asked us if we have ever done Nero di Troia which is a grape/wine from Puglia, so I am going to see if we can find it. 
• Doug suggested we do some more reasonably priced Willamette Pinot Noirs and we love that idea so we’ll put that on the list, too

Wines coming up in future episodes in case you want to drink along with us 51:06

• Erbaluce: Cieck Erbaluce di Caluso 2024, Luigi Ferrando La Torrazza Erbaluce di Caluso 2024
• Limoux Cremant: Vanderpump Cremant di Limoux Brut, Faire La Fete Brut Rose
• Cote du Rhone: Domaine de la Janasse Cotes du Rhone Reserve 2022, E. Guigal Cotes du Rhone Rouge 2023
• Burgundy Cremant: Simonnet-Febvre Cremant de Bourgogne Brut, JCB No. 69 Brut Rose Cremant de Bourgogne
• Mondeuse: 2020 Bernard et Christophe Richel Savoie Mondeuse, 2023 Domaine Jean Vullien & Fils Mondeuse
• Grillo: 2023 Brugnano Vinovanta Grillo, 2025 Poggio Anima Uriel Grillo

Outro and how to find The Wine Pair Podcast 51:27

Thank you for listening to us and for supporting our show, and remember, we buy all of our own wine and we do all of the writing and recording and editing to bring you a show every week because we absolutely love doing it, and our small little ask for you is that you please follow or subscribe to our podcast and also please leave us a nice rating and review  to help us grow our listeners - and a huge thank you to all of you who have done so already! 

You can also follow us on Instagram and Bluesky and TikTok at thewinepairpodcast. You can contact us on our website thewinepairpodcast.com, and you can sign up for our email newsletter there and you can also visit our “Shop Wine” section where you can find links to buy the wines that we rate as buys in each episode.  I will also note that on our website, if you are curious about a wine we have covered in the past, we do have a pretty good search functionality, so you can use that find wines you want to know more about. 

And we want to make content you care about and you like, so send us a note or DM us and give us some feedback or let us know if there are wines you want us to try or wine making areas of the world you are curious about - and we’ll take care of it! joe@thewinepairpodcast.com 

Alright, with that, we are going to sign off, so thanks again, and we will see you next time. And, as we say, life is short, so stop drinking shitty wine.

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FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS

Q. Is Juliet wine worth buying?
A. For the wine alone, probably not. In tasting, the Sauvignon Blanc came across thin and bitter rather than crisp, and the Pinot Noir more like cherry cough syrup than Pinot Noir. The cylinder packaging is striking, so at $35 for 1.5 liters, about $17.50 a bottle, it makes more sense as a gift or picnic wine than a value pick.

Q. Who makes Juliet wine?
A. Juliet's website doesn't name its winemaker. Founders Allison Luvera and Lauren De Niro Pipher have marketing backgrounds, not winemaking ones, and the wine is made at a Certified California Sustainable winery in the Santa Barbara region. Juliet shares little about how the wines are made, such as oak use, or fermentation processes, a drawback at a premium price.

Q. What does Juliet Pinot Noir taste like?
A. The 2023 Juliet Pinot Noir, from Edna Valley, California, doesn't taste much like Pinot Noir. It's dark purple and cloudy like grape juice, with raisin, dried cranberry, molasses and smoke on the nose. It starts big but thins out fast and stays one-note, like watered-down cherry liqueur or cough syrup.

Q. Is premium boxed wine actually good now?
A. It can be. The box itself isn't the problem: boxed wine's cheap reputation came from bottom-shelf, mass-produced wine, much as screw caps were once wrongly tied to cheap bottles. Respected wineries like Tablas Creek now put wine in boxes, but plenty of boxed wine is still mass-produced, and stylish packaging doesn't guarantee what's inside.

Q. What does Juliet Sauvignon Blanc taste like?

A. The 2022 Juliet Sauvignon Blanc, from California's Santa Ynez Valley, isn't crisp or refreshing and comes across almost like a Chardonnay. It's golden, with lemon, pineapple, pear and a hint of vanilla, then a thin, bitter, pithy palate with peach, grapefruit and an oaky, tea-like note.

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RESEARCH ARTICLES AND LINKS FOR THIS EPISODE

• https://drinkjuliet.com/pages/about?srsltid=AU7gw4WIu0-LHj9lAU9gDjJxGRhyU12uWbjLGjOPVo329iivJ0LNSGTL
• https://www.forbes.com/sites/ronniekoenig/2024/03/09/juliet-founder-on-women-in-wine-and-her-favorite-pairing-with-take-out/
• https://www.retailbrew.com/stories/2025/06/24/how-juliet-brought-boxed-wine-to-big-box-stores
• https://thedieline.com/juliet-infuses-the-mediterranean-lifestyle-into-its-cylindrical-boxed-wines/
• https://unbreakablebrands.com/thinking-outside-bottle-juliet-revolutionizing-boxed-wine/
• https://www.femalefounderworld.com/case-studies/allison-luvera-juliet
• https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/first-juliet-reimagined-boxed-wine-162847274.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAK369RfJ4SghOOzBYqGd07BTeMmAqNGYvl7jVfYKQL5-b5plpqVIt5uqSz2cyMqoLw2H5gZDoBr37y89f2pbuwrISQjRVQPJpUL9radHZgRU0VVxJ1ZOe2sFSGxDoa1td5f9TBJiAHMqG-hlkhXrMKftdzvZ3XwBXLDuEYAKe4GL
• https://honestecommerce.com/blogs/episodes/343-testing-high-in-luxury-market-with-allison-luvera-lauren-de-niro-pipher
• https://www.vogue.com/article/is-boxed-wine-becoming-cool
• https://www.inc.com/ali-donaldson/forget-franzia-boxed-wine-went-bougie-now-sales-have-surged-more-than-144-percent/91378519
• https://dmsretail.com/RetailNews/juliet-wine-is-elevating-the-boxed-wine-market-and-attracting-big-name-investors/
• https://www.packagingconnections.com/news/juliet-wines-keeps-sustainability-mind-their-new-wines-packaging-design.htm
• https://www.modernretail.co/marketing/boxed-wine-startups-are-trying-to-build-viable-dtc-businesses/
• https://adage.com/article/podcast-marketers-brief/how-juliet-wine-making-boxed-wine-sophisticated/2536441/
• https://www.weststwine.com/pages/juliet-wine-sauvignon-blanc
• https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tp1-04rCrZU
• https://www.dearfoundher.com/podcast/s4-ep-287-thinking-outside-of-the-sustainable-box-when-it-comes-to-wine-with-lauren-de-niro-pipher-founder-of-juliet-wine
• https://www.forbes.com/sites/lmowery/2022/12/06/wine-in-a-bag-in-a-box-with-recylable-packaging-and-its-delcious-yes-juliet-wine-is-the-real-deal/
• https://www.tasteradio.com/episodes/the-best-way-to-think-outside-the-box-get-rid-of-the-box
• https://citrusdiaries.substack.com/p/allison-luvera-and-lauren-de-niro
• https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fiGio8FoxD8
• https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-Tsj-ItDCE
• https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUab9m0pay4
• https://www.inc.com/inc-video/everyone-stopped-drinking-so-why-is-boxed-wine-booming/91416124
• https://www.winespectator.com/articles/boxed-wine-rising-quality-best-top-recommendations
• https://wineinsiders.com/blogs/wine-101-wine-basics/whats-the-deal-with-boxed-wine?srsltid=AU7gw4XmGqvDbrWKVyaaE9jykcP1O5U5idNY3iB0UQ76WVkurJmC1jjS
• https://ocadoretail.com/media-centre/press-releases/gen-zommeliers-younger-consumers-drive-boom-in-boxed-and-canned-wine/
• https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-15017231/Gen-Z-drives-boom-boxed-wine-cheaper-sustainable.html 
• https://blog.chus.wine/en/blog/gen-z-may-drink-less-but-theyre-spending-more-on-wine
• https://www.marketwatchmag.com/boxed-wines-go-big/
• https://www.glamour.com/story/boxed-wine-is-back-and-better-than-you-remember

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FULL TRANSCRIPT

Joe: 00:00
Carmela, boxed wine is having a moment.

Carmela: 00:03
Oh, I know.

Joe: 00:03
And Juliet boxed wine is a beautifully put together box wine. It's not even a box, it's a cylinder. Right. It's wonderful looking, though, right?

Carmela: 00:13
So cool. I love it.

Joe: 00:14
But the question is, does the wine stand up to the packaging?

Carmela: 00:19
Hmm. You'll have to find out.

Joe: 00:20
You're gonna have to find out. Maybe it does, maybe it doesn't. We'll give you the straight truth. Hello, fellow Star Crossed wine lovers, and welcome to the Wine Pair Podcast. I'm Joe, your simolier of reasonably priced wine, and this is my wife and my wine pairing partner in crime, Carmela.

Carmela: 00:44
Hi there!

Joe: 00:44
And we are the Wine Pair.

Carmela: 00:46
I like that name. Did you make that name up?

Joe: 00:48
Well, we're gonna get to it in a second.

Carmela: 00:50
Okay, cute.

Joe: 00:50
Okay, if you're new to our podcast, here's what we do. Every week we buy wines under $25 with our own money. We taste them and give you our brutally honest opinion on whether they're worth buying. Nobody pays us to review specific wines. We don't accept free bottles from wineries, and we're not afraid to call out a bad wine when we taste one. And Decanter magazine calls us fun, irreverent, chatty, and entertaining. So if that sounds like your vibe, welcome to our tribe of Star-Crossed wine lovers.

Carmela: 01:17
I need some explanation around that.

Joe: 01:20
It's gonna come to you very quickly. Okay. But it's very strategic.

Carmela: 01:24
Okay. See, the sap around it is just my name.

Joe: 01:27
You're gonna get it and you're gonna love it. Okay, Carmella. This week we're doing something that I thought we would do a lot more of when we started this podcast, but we actually have not done very often, and that is tasting and reviewing boxed wine.

Carmela: 01:40
Wow.

Joe: 01:40
Yeah, and boxed wine is having a bit of a moment again, I guess, but it still is a reputation problem it's trying to get over with some audiences. And we'll talk about that in a bit. But although many serious wine drinkers are dubious about boxed wine, younger drinkers are actually becoming more attracted to it.

Carmela: 01:58
Oh, talking about Starcross lovers.

Joe: 02:00
That's right. So a few months ago, I asked in our newsletter if our listeners would like to hear more about boxed wine, and we got enough responses that I felt good about doing some periodic episodes on it. Okay. And we will generally focus on boxed wines with better reputations, which also means a bit more expensive and maybe something you have to search a little harder for. And so this week we are going to be tasting and reviewing Juliet boxed wines.

Carmela: 02:26
Oh my gosh, everything's just getting better and better.

Joe: 02:29
Has it come to you yet?

Carmela: 02:31
Well, I mean Starcrossed wine lovers, Juliet. Yeah, I know, of course.

Joe: 02:36
Okay, we'll talk about the makers of Juliet, who came up with the name Juliet in uh in our next section. But before we do that, I thought we'd talk a little bit about the rise of boxed wine.

unknown: 02:48
Okay.

Joe: 02:49
So now for most of us who are maybe a little on the older side.

Carmela: 02:52
Wow.

Joe: 02:52
I don't want to age you, Carmela.

Carmela: 02:54
I was gonna say, why are you pointing at me?

Joe: 02:55
I'm not pointing at you. Yeah, why are you looking at me? Side-eyeing you. Wow. Boxed wine has had a pretty lousy reputation, and it was generally associated with cheap, mass-produced wine, mostly driven by producers like Francia that were and are on the bottom of the shelf of your grocery store.

Carmela: 03:13
Still then, huh?

Joe: 03:14
Yeah, and its whole appeal was that it had a very low price, often the equivalent of just a few bucks a bottle, came in large quantities, which some people really like, and frequently it was on the sweeter side and could last for a long time once it was opened. And I think part of the problem is that since box wine came so closely associated with cheap wine, that people started to assume that any wine that came in a box must be cheap wine and not very good quality. And it, Carmela, it wasn't necessarily the box that was the problem, kind of like screw caps. We love a screw cap. Right. Today, some great wines come in screw caps, but the expectation has been that only cheap wines come in bottles with screw caps. That's changing as well. And so box wine is also sort of experiencing a kind of a renaissance. For instance, in 2024, overall wine sales in the United States declined by 3.5%. But sales of boxed wine actually grew 4%.

Carmela: 04:09
Wow.

Joe: 04:10
And even more interesting, sales of boxed wines priced at $28 or more for a three-liter box grew by nearly 9%. So the more expensive, not that that's expensive, but they're on the more expensive side for boxed wine. And so that higher price segment alone accounted for approximately $1.6 billion with a B dollars in sales. Wow. So while the wine industry as a whole has been struggling lately, it seems clear that there's something appealing about boxed wines to some audiences. I mean, wow.

Carmela: 04:41
Something within that box.

Joe: 04:43
That's right.

Carmela: 04:44
Calling people's names.

Joe: 04:45
Calling well, let's talk about the people it's calling. Okay. Because some audiences, particularly younger drinkers, seem much I mean, they're they're of legal age. Let's not go there. I was just gonna ask. No, but younger drinkers seem much more open to box wine than old people like us.

Carmela: 05:00
Well, because why do you think that? Are we gonna talk about that?

Joe: 05:02
Or well, what do you think?

Carmela: 05:04
Well, I mean, I you know what? They're being financially responsible.

Joe: 05:08
That's one reason for sure.

Carmela: 05:10
Right? Good for them, you know? Embrace the box.

Joe: 05:14
Other reasons why you might think?

Carmela: 05:15
Um, I don't know. I mean, it maybe it's a trend. Maybe they're trying to, you know, they're trying to feed a lot of people with that box wine.

Joe: 05:23
I think that's probably part of it as well. Yeah, for sure.

Carmela: 05:26
Large and they're inexpensive. Margin and charge. Okay, are easy to find.

Joe: 05:31
Easy to find, easy to carry around.

Carmela: 05:33
Right, they're not gonna break.

Joe: 05:35
That's right. You don't have to have a wine opener. They're also more environmentally positive as well. Well, so we're gonna talk about that.

Carmela: 05:42
Yes, even with the plastic bag inside and all that.

Joe: 05:45
Yes, yeah. So we'll talk about that in a second. But according to a 2025 survey in the UK, nearly 60% of Gen Z responders said they were happy to drink wine from a box or a can, and 57% believe the quality of boxed wine had improved. And there's something similar in the US. A 2024 survey of nearly 4,000 American adults found that 40% of Gen Z respondents believe boxed wine was better for the environment compared to just 23% of baby boomers.

Carmela: 06:16
But do we know this for sure? Yes, we do.

Joe: 06:18
Oh, we do because we talked about it in our last boxed wine episode. But revisit that. Yeah, there's a lower footprint. You can go back to that one, lower footprint, recycled materials, etc. You're not it's not a single-use like bottle. So it is definitely and it's less expensive to transport, so it doesn't have as much of a carbon footprint. So yeah, definitely it's true. And when asked which packaging they preferred, back to this survey, younger wine drinkers were more likely to choose boxed wine than older folks.

Carmela: 06:46
Were they like the look of it?

Joe: 06:48
I I think that's part of it as well. Oh, I think they may be a little bit sort of rejecting some of the fancy schmancy aspects of wine.

Carmela: 06:56
Now we're rebelling about against it. That's right. I mean, we're not rebelling against the box wine, we're rebelling against the bottle.

Joe: 07:02
And and the people who are snobby about the bottle, maybe.

unknown: 07:05
Oh.

Joe: 07:05
Yeah. Okay. So what we can take away from this is that younger consumers are less concerned about good wine coming in a traditional glass bottle and more interested in things like convenience, price, and sustainability, which we've been talking about. Okay. And I think that's interesting because so much of the wine industry has been built around these, you know, traditional trappings of wine. Things like fancy bottles and natural corks and the labels and the names and where they're from and you know, specific vineyards and well, and they're trying to make it less serious, which is what we also kind of strive to do. That's right.

Carmela: 07:39
So I like that.

Joe: 07:41
I like you're connecting it back to us. Right. Well, like that. Of course. Yeah. But maybe we're also finding that younger dr drinkers just don't care about that stuff as much.

Carmela: 07:48
Well, and I that one thing I'm just trying to figure out, and I guess we're gonna find out a little bit tonight, is how is it really how is does it really taste?

Joe: 07:55
Well, that is the key. I mean, that is the main thing.

Carmela: 07:58
Because are they just like you know, like plugging their nose and taking taking down a glass?

Joe: 08:02
I mean, I can't we can't represent every boxed wine. No. But we can represent this boxed wine and see what we think. Right. Yes, that's right. But again, let's talk about some practical reasons for people becoming more favorable to boxed wine. That it generally costs less to package and ship. As I mentioned, it has a lower carbon footprint than glass bottles, which are heavy and heavier to transport. It can stay fresh four to six weeks after opening because the bag inside the box limits exposure to oxygen or air. And we mentioned this in the episode from the last from last year on boxed wine, but boxed wine should really be called bagged wine. Because it's it's in a bag and the box is like the packaging around it, but that's kind of beside the point. And then again, when you consider the price point on a per bottle basis, boxed wine can be a pretty good deal. So, for reference, many boxed wine comes in three-liter sizes, which is equivalent to four standard bottles of wine. Holy cow. So if you're paying 30 bucks or less, that's a part, that's a party in a box. Yeah, exactly. In a bag. And when you consider the price of a bottle, that's a really low per bottle price and it lasts for a long time. And so you're not just poop popping open a bottle and then you have to drink it, or it's gonna go bad. Like you can spend much less on a per bottle basis and just keep that in your fridge and drink it whenever you want to.

Carmela: 09:15
It's like having a winerator.

Joe: 09:17
It is like a wine. It's like a kegerator for wine. I like that. A winerator. We're gonna call them winerators.

Carmela: 09:23
Pop that thing in your fridge and just what it doesn't have like a little thing in the floor. It does have a little spigot. Yeah. A little spout. Yeah, cute little spout. Oh my goodness, it could last you all week.

Joe: 09:34
All year, maybe. No, weeks, weeks, weeks.

Carmela: 09:37
I know, but I'm thinking some people might just last a couple days.

Joe: 09:40
Or a minute or two. But anyway, the wine industry, Carmela, has started looking more favorably at boxed wine. Respected wineries like Toblis Creek and Bedbrock Wine, along with newer brands like Nomadica and Juliet that we're drinking this week, have started putting higher quality wines into the boxes. At least that's what they say, and we're gonna find that out today. And some of these brands have also completely redesigned the packaging to make the box look cooler. Oh, and so I think that's part of the attention.

Carmela: 10:07
They do kind of want the box to look cool now.

Joe: 10:10
For sure, yeah.

Carmela: 10:10
So they can't just say, oh, we don't really care.

Joe: 10:13
Exactly. Now, none of this means that boxed wine has suddenly become universally respected or that everything sold in a box is good. There are still plenty of inexpensive, mass-produced, pretty crummy boxed wine out there. And again, we're not trying to yuck your yum, but you that's the way we feel about it. But the perception is changing. And as kind of you're talking about, the question is, is this is it just clever marketing or is the wine really better? And so on that note, we're gonna taste and review one of the more popular premium boxed wine brands. It's got a lot of attention called Juliet, and we have two of their boxed wines to drink today. One is a Sauvignon Blanc, and the other is a Pinot Noir.

Carmela: 10:52
Okay, so you're catering towards what we like.

Joe: 10:54
Exactly. We're gonna give them a real shot to impress us because those are two of our favorite varietals. But on the flip side, we also have kind of a high bar for them.

Carmela: 11:03
True.

Joe: 11:03
And so they're gonna have to hit a high bar, but we're gonna give them a real shot. We're not choosing a wine that we don't really love, and then we can say, Oh, I don't think the wine's very good.

Carmela: 11:10
We're gonna We should have done this blind.

Joe: 11:12
Blind.

Carmela: 11:13
I mean, we should have not have known like where this was coming from.

Joe: 11:16
Well, it would be very hard because I buy the wine. What? So it would have been really difficult to totally. I could have blinded you. Right.

Carmela: 11:25
One of these times maybe you do that.

Joe: 11:27
Maybe there's been many times I'm not just wanting to blind you, but mute you as well.

Carmela: 11:32
I'm the one that was like, maybe I want to be the blind one.

Joe: 11:34
Sometimes I want to be deaf.

Carmela: 11:36
Maybe, okay, we'll make an agreement.

Joe: 11:38
I'll be blind, you'll be deaf. Oh, I see where you're going. I get it. Okay.

Carmela: 11:43
For Halloween.

Joe: 11:44
Well, anyway, on that note, we're gonna see if these wines meet our bar, but first, you gotta do our shameless plug. That's right. I had to get out of that one. So thank you for listening to us and for supporting our show. And know that again, we've I've said this now 12 times and I will say it 12 more times. We buy all the wine we taste and review every week so that we can give you real and honest reviews. And if you like what you're hearing, please subscribe to our podcast and leave us a five-star rating in review so we can grow listeners. And thanks to everybody who's done that. We love to hear from you. We always respond. You can follow us on Instagram and Blue Sky and TikTok at the WinePair Podcast. You can contact us on our website, thewinepairpodcast.com. You can sign up for our email newsletter there. You can always also send us a note at Joe at the winepairpodcast.com. Just tell us how you're doing. Tell us how you feel about boxed wine. Are you a boxed wine fan? Is there a boxed wine that you really like? Are you totally against boxed wine? Do you love Juliet and Romeo?

Carmela: 12:37
Why does it have to be about wine?

Joe: 12:38
It does not have to be about wine at all. It could be about your dog. We don't care.

Carmela: 12:42
Okay. Talk about anything. Right. He will listen.

Joe: 12:45
And as we do every week, we'll tell you someone we think you should recommend the wine pair podcast to, because frankly, that's the best way for us to grow listeners when you tell your family and friends about us. And this week, we want you to recommend us to anyone who's been curious about these new, more expensive and cool looking boxed wines, but's been afraid to try them. Or anyone you know who's a boxed wine either lover or skeptic. That's kind of it kind of runs the gamut. But so we kind of just want you to send this episode to anybody. Everybody. Yeah.

Carmela: 13:11
Not anybody, everybody.

Joe: 13:13
Yeah, that's right. Carmela, let's find out just what the f Juliet boxed wine is, shall we? Let's do it. Okay, so now we're gonna talk about the history and current state of Juliet wine, but this is not meant to be an advertisement for them because we don't do that kind of stuff. And so we're gonna see if there's any controversy or concern around the brand and wine as well. And trust me, there is. We're gonna get to it. Now, Juliet Wine was founded in 2021, so it's not very old, by longtime friends Allison Luvera and Lauren De Niro Pfeiffer. They met in c in college.

Carmela: 13:44
Are they a man and a woman? Not that this matters, but are they like a Romeo and Juliet? No, it's two women. Oh, okay, but they still could be a Romeo and Juliet.

Joe: 13:52
This is true.

Carmela: 13:52
It would be Romeo and Juliet. Romeo and Juliet.

Joe: 13:55
That's right. I mean, who knows?

Carmela: 13:56
No, you can be a Romeo and Juliet and be anyway.

Joe: 13:59
You can be anything you want to be. We will we we love people who love. It doesn't matter what you are.

Carmela: 14:04
Love comes in all shapes, sizes, forms, forms. That's right. Love is love.

Joe: 14:08
Love is love. Okay. Can I get back to the wine? Yes. Okay. Allison has achieved West level two as an MBA from Wharton, so she's no dummy. Okay. And she worked in fashion media and luxury marketing before she started Juliet. And then her friend Laura has a background in interior design, luxury properties, and fashion PR. So both of these women have had backgrounds in luxury and fashion.

Carmela: 14:33
Right design.

Joe: 14:34
I mean, but but no experience in winemaking.

Carmela: 14:38
Okay.

Joe: 14:38
So we're gonna come to that in a minute. Okay, during the pandemic, Alison Luvera was living at her parents' home, as many people were, and she drank some boxed wine from the fridge, and she liked aspects of this fridge wine, like that the wine kept fresh longer and the lower carbon footprint, but she felt the category was missing some chic. And that's kind of her background, right?

Carmela: 14:58
Uh-huh.

Joe: 14:59
And so she and her friend Lauren spent 18 months coming up with an affordable luxury boxed wine, including developing the brand, the wine, and the packaging. Now, in the wine world, that is rocket ship fast. 18 months is not a long time.

Carmela: 15:14
And it's also during COVID, though. That's true. What else did you have to do? You've been putting in 20 hours a day.

Joe: 15:20
That's that's absolutely right. But in the wine making world, you know, if you're growing your own grapes, you need a lot more than 18 months. So again, different approach, but just you know, not good or bad. So the packaging was actually one of their main areas of focus. And rather than settling on the common box shape, they created a one and a half liter container. That's two bottles of wine. They called it eco or echo magnum. Would you say eco or echo? Eco. Okay. What would you say? Uh eco magnum. I say whatever you say. Oh, really? Yeah. I'm mute though. So there's that. I didn't hear it. Okay, but that also makes it, huh? But you can't see it. Okay, which also makes sense since a magnum is one and a half liters or two bottles of wine. Now they base the design of the packaging on things like luxury handbags and luxury whiskey containers. And the current packaging includes carrying straps.

Carmela: 16:08
I was just gonna ask that. Yeah. Like, can you put it on your shoulder?

Joe: 16:12
I don't think they're long enough to do that, but they, you know, they come in little, you can walk around with them. I love it. And for the design on the packaging, they aim for a Mediterranean-inspired aesthetic.

Carmela: 16:21
Okay.

Joe: 16:22
So this probably goes without saying, but the packaging does seem focused on a more female audience. When we look at it, I want you to think, I want you to see if that's true.

Carmela: 16:30
I think so. Yeah.

Joe: 16:32
Now for the wine itself, they partner with a certified California sustainable winery in Happy Canyon, which is in the Santa Barbara Central Coast area of California. They say the wines are made in a low intervention style. They use the term clean, which I really don't like. They say their wines have no artificial additives, synthetic pesticides, or added sugar. And we've mentioned this in a recent mini sode, but that's a lot of that is kind of marketing speak because most wines are made without additives and without added sugar. Although I'm not sure that can be said for a lot of inexpensive boxed wines. It wouldn't surprise me if they have a lot of additives and added sugar. So from a boxed wine perspective, totally fair. Their packaging is also 100% recyclable paperboard, and they have a prepaid take back program for recycling the plastic pouches. So that's that's a cool idea.

Carmela: 17:22
That is.

Joe: 17:27
Well, it sounds like maybe they reuse them.

Carmela: 17:28
If you can take the page, I know, but just in general, a wine in a plastic pouch.

Joe: 17:33
Okay, ladies and gentlemen, this is the truth. Carmela has been on an anti-plastic rampage for like a week now. I think she's worried.

Carmela: 17:40
My daughter, she's got me all crazy about it. She told me now that I shouldn't take receipts. Have you guys heard that?

Joe: 17:46
I don't let's not go down that path. But evidently, don't touch receipts anymore. Unless you have gloves. Wear gloves.

Carmela: 17:52
Yeah, you just reject them. You just reject those receipts. I mean, okay, anyway. That's such a lot. But no. Wow. Yeah, so the plastic pouch. Anyway.

Joe: 17:59
You don't love it.

Carmela: 18:00
I don't love it for a couple of reasons, but we don't have to go down that road.

Joe: 18:03
We've gone down it.

Carmela: 18:04
Oh. Well, I mean, I will say, does it rub, does it change the taste?

Joe: 18:09
Let us know what you think, people.

Carmela: 18:11
Those of you who drink from a pouch, a plastic pouch.

Joe: 18:15
Let us know.

Carmela: 18:16
Yeah. Okay. Again, I do what you want to do. You do you.

Joe: 18:21
Do what you want to do.

Carmela: 18:22
We're going to find out tonight.

Joe: 18:23
Can we go back to the wine? Yes. Okay. So one note that kind of bothers me a little bit is that it was really hard to find out who actually makes their wine. So clearly the founders do not make the wine because they're not winemakers. And I don't really like the fact that we don't know who the winemakers are. So fundamentally, just this is, you know, I'm not sure, I'm just going to state my feelings here. It's a white label brand. It's focused on the marketing and the packaging.

Carmela: 18:49
Right.

Joe: 18:50
It doesn't mean that the wine's not going to be good or there's anything wrong with the wine, but I like to know who the winemaker is. That matters to me.

Carmela: 18:56
It's not really for, it may not be for like a serious wine drinker. And I know you're like not always serious about wine, but like somebody who is kind of a wine nerd, tech nerd guy.

Joe: 19:08
Yeah, that's probably I think that's a totally fair point that it may not be made for them. It may be made for the people who like are the average person who buy a lot more wine than the nerds.

Carmela: 19:18
Well, right. So let's we will find out, I guess.

Joe: 19:20
Yes, we will. And then another thing that's kind of interesting about Juliet is their business model and strategy. They started out as a mostly direct-to-consumer brand with its own online storefront, and they used that as a testing ground to make sure that they had a market, that they understood the price points that customers were willing to pay and all that stuff. So that's pretty smart. And remember, Allison Luvera went to Wharton. So she's not done, not she's no dummy. And after they had proven that they that they were a brand that customers wanted, they started some wholesale distribution. They began an independent wine shops in places like New York and California. And now they're in stores more broadly. So again, another really smart approach to how they kind of built this brand. And as you might expect from the background of the founders, they had a pretty aggressive PR strategy. And being part of a younger generation than we are, they also really focused on brand evangelists via social media. So it's a very millennial or Gen Z approach to marketing.

Carmela: 20:17
They're bringing back the box. You got to bring it back. You gotta bring it.

Joe: 20:20
You gotta bring it. You gotta bring it. And they were also able to get into higher-end venues like luxury resorts and upscale dining spots as a way to kind of further solidify their brand image and reach a specific kind of customer. So again, very smart. So, in terms of their current business, they are not publicly traded, so they don't have to share a lot of things because of that. But and and they're still pretty young. Again, so they're still building their brand. One of the things that's interesting, too, about Juliet is that despite all of the attention the brand has received for its packaging and its sustainability and its upskill image, the reputation of the wine itself is kind of mixed. Now, to be clear, Juliet doesn't seem to have been involved in any major controversies or scandals that we could find, but there are some questions about whether the quality of the wine lives up to the marketing. So for example, wine enthusiasts reviewed their 2021 Pinot Noir and gave it 87 points and an editor's choice designation. That's a pretty good score. Although the review wasn't exactly glowing, which makes me wonder a little bit why it got an editor's choice, so you can color me a little bit skeptical, but you know what? That's fine. Consumer Reports was even less enthusiastic about Juliet's Sauvignon Blanc. In a review of boxed wines, their tasters found the wine to be pretty unremarkable, describing it as inoffensive. Is that bad?

Carmela: 21:37
It's not great.

Joe: 21:38
Yeah. And they also questioned the value, arguing that consumers could probably find as good or better Sauignon Blanc for the same money. So again, not a super glowing review.

Carmela: 21:48
If somebody's looking for a specific look, maybe they would go for the Juliet.

Joe: 21:53
They're okay with it. So this is probably the biggest question about Juliet. Whether you're paying for a better wine or clever packaging. And marketing. Their wines, again, sell for about $35 for a one and a half liter package that works out to about $17.50 per bottle, which puts it squarely actually in the premium tier of wine. So it's not an outrageous price. It's not, you know, $25, $30 per bottle, but it's also not cheap. And there are good wines, good Sauvignon Blancs. I mean, go to Costco to get at that price point. So what are you paying for? The brand or the wine? We're gonna find out. And again, I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with building a wine brand around beautiful packaging and a certain aesthetic. As you said, some people really love that. Those are reasons why people may choose a wine. I mean, after all, most people buy wines based on the label. In fact, there are a lot of studies. 80, 80, 85% of people buy wines based on the label. So the aesthetic matters. I mean, let's not pretend like it doesn't. Right. Yes. But when you start positioning your wine as a premium product at a premium price point, I think it probably better taste like it.

Carmela: 23:04
I think so.

Joe: 23:05
Yeah. And that's what we're going to find out today. So let's find out more about these wines that we're drinking today, shall we? Okay. All right. So the wines we have chosen for this episode were $35 each, as I just mentioned, but again, on a per bottle basis, $17.50. So not bad. They should be relatively easy to find. I bought them directly on the Juliet website. The delivery was pretty fast, pretty easy. The packages that they came in were undamaged, so that's good.

Carmela: 23:31
Well, that is a good start.

Joe: 23:32
Yeah. Because it's cardboard, it's not glass. So that's, you know, sometimes they can get squished or something. Sure. But it was actually fine. And they're starting to sell more and more in stores like Costco and Whole Foods and Total Wine. We have not seen them here in our local versions of those stores. And they still sell about 30% of their wine directly to consumers online rather than through stores. The question for me is will they be able to hold on to their quality and their natural approach to wine if they get much bigger? And then as far as finding them in your local neighborhood wine shop, I'm not sure you're going to find it there. But as always, you should just ask your local wine shop and see if they will source the wine for you. Now, the first wine we're going to drink is the 2022 Juliet Sauvignon Blanc, and I couldn't find any professional reviews for this wine, for this version of the wine, the 2022. Although it has shown up in some best box wine lists like Food and Wine, and remember, consumer reports called it inoffensive. There's very little information about the wine, even on the Juliet website.

Carmela: 24:31
Really?

Joe: 24:31
They don't give a great sense of the tasting notes. All I can say is that the grapes come from the central valley of California, specifically the Santa Inez Valley. And I will also say for Save Blanc, the alcohol is pretty high. It's 13.7%.

Carmela: 24:47
Ah, well.

Joe: 24:48
That's pretty high. Again, a party box. Party in a box. That's right. I don't love that there are very few professional reviews, mostly because for a wine that's growing in popularity and has a very progressive and aggressive PR machine, I would expect to hear more. I mean, again, they show up in a lot of magazines and they show up in a lot of interviews, but they're mostly pieces about the founders and not the wine. So whatever. And this wine is also from California's Central Coast, this time from Edna Valley. Again, this wine is also pretty high in alcohol for a Pinot Noir. It's almost 15%. It's 14.7%. So it's pretty high.

Carmela: 25:30
See, sometimes the young, you know, the young people, they want they want everything.

Joe: 25:33
They want to get crunk.

Carmela: 25:34
I mean, that's okay. That's okay. They're not spending a lot, they're getting a good-looking box of wine. And they're getting drunk. They're getting drunk.

Joe: 25:41
There you go.

Carmela: 25:42
What more do you want?

Joe: 25:43
I agree. It does make me a little nervous that we're gonna get like a California style Pinot Noir, which often to me reminds me a little bit more of a Cabernet Sauvignon than a Pinot Noir. But again, we'll find out. And again, very little information about the wine. I'm a little bothered. I keep, you know, I'm trying, I'm trying, I feel like I'm pretty bothered, but you know, I'll get over it. But anyway, this is a bigger wine company. They they could certainly give more information about how the wine is made or if it's oaked or if they use malolactic fermentation or if they where they find it.

Carmela: 26:14
I just don't think that's the objective.

Joe: 26:17
I get it. But to me, again, if you're paying for a premium wine, you know, premium tiered wine, I think you want to know a little. It's more to me, it's not everybody.

Carmela: 26:25
But they're they're they just don't seem to be catering to certain kinds of people. Or they are catering to others.

Joe: 26:31
Yeah, I guess so.

Carmela: 26:33
Not everybody's gonna go on and search this information out.

Joe: 26:35
No, again, and I hope I'm not being overly annoying in in calling all this stuff out. I I know again, some people don't care. They're not gonna research it. It's not important to them. What they care about is does it look nice, does it taste okay? Fine, I'm good. But I think that's that that's about all I can tell you about these wines. I don't have a lot much else to say. So on that note, I think it's time to start drinking. So if you have a Juliet boxed wine, they're Sauvignon Blanc or Pinot Noir, or you have any boxed wine at all, or any Juliet wine, whatever, just drink along with us.

Carmela: 27:06
Well, wow.

Joe: 27:08
And and we'll be right back. Okay, we are back and we are ready to taste our first wine. This is the Juliet Savignon Blanc. It's from Santa Inez, California. It's the 2022 vintage. Again, it was $35 for the equivalent of two bottles. The retailer was the website, the Juliet website. 13.7% alcohol, 100% Sauvignon Blanc. No professional ratings that I could find. But Carmela, let's talk about the packaging first since we talked so much about the packaging. What do you think about the packaging?

Carmela: 27:39
Well, you know, I think it's pretty cool. I like it. Do you? Yeah, I mean, uh it's definitely different than the traditional box. It's not a box. No, it's a cylinder, it's got a cute little rope handle. And I want to just look at the pouch. Oh, um can you do that?

Joe: 27:55
Well, you can, but you have to like remove the tape. Oh, I see. Okay. I would have to do that. But you can see it through the where the tap is.

Carmela: 28:01
It's in there. It's a pouch. It's kind of weird.

Joe: 28:03
It's kind of weird.

Carmela: 28:04
Um, I always feel like it's a little weird, but um, but no, it's very pretty. It after there's a lot of thought put into this container.

Joe: 28:11
I mean, it's got nice design, very good colors.

Carmela: 28:14
Yeah, yeah. No, it's a it's pretty. I I think it's a kind of a cool gift.

Joe: 28:18
You like it. Yes. You're into it.

Carmela: 28:20
Um, yeah. I do think that like just toping this around would be kind of a a lady thing to do, but I don't think we should say that. So we didn't.

Joe: 28:29
Okay, we didn't say.

unknown: 28:31
All right. Um good.

Joe: 28:32
Okay, now let's talk about the color of the wine. What do you think?

Carmela: 28:36
It's light.

Joe: 28:37
It's light.

Carmela: 28:38
Um, it's kind of golden, you know. It is. What do you think?

Joe: 28:41
I think it looks uncuous.

Carmela: 28:43
It looks thick to me. Yours definitely does. I've lessened my glass.

Joe: 28:47
I got the first pour too.

Carmela: 28:48
Yeah, yours looks like actually like liquid gold.

Joe: 28:51
It does. It is a little gold.

Carmela: 28:52
Should we have shaken this?

Joe: 28:55
Shake your box before you open it, ladies and gentlemen. I don't know. I mean, may maybe I just the first yours is definitely lighter.

Carmela: 29:02
Way lighter.

Joe: 29:02
Mine looks like, I don't, it does, it looks gold. I hope I got the same one. Did you pour out of a different box?

Carmela: 29:08
I don't know.

Joe: 29:09
Oh, it's the same one. I don't know. It's weird. Okay.

Carmela: 29:11
I like that the Juliet lettering is in gold. Do you?

Joe: 29:14
I like it too.

Carmela: 29:16
Just because the the wine is sort of the same color.

Joe: 29:18
You're so right. I know. Especially the wine in my glass. Okay, let's smell it and see what we think.

Carmela: 29:23
Okay. Citrusy, lemony.

Joe: 29:26
Um I'm getting a little tropical fruit on it. A little bit of that Sauvignon Blanc tropical fruit. Maybe a little pineapple.

Carmela: 29:33
I'm actually getting like a hint of of pear.

Joe: 29:36
Oh, okay. I like that. I like pear. I don't know.

Carmela: 29:38
I don't know. I don't think it smells like a super traditional Sauvignon.

Joe: 29:42
You don't think so.

Carmela: 29:42
I mean, you were getting tropical.

Joe: 29:43
I think some tropical fruit. Okay. You might be getting a little it's got a little heat on it, like a little gasoline or something. Yeah, I love it.

Carmela: 29:51
Especially when you swirl. Yeah, it's got a glass.

Joe: 29:53
Yeah, it's got a little uh little alcohol on it.

Carmela: 29:56
Now, what should we be drinking this out of? A wine glass, a cup?

Joe: 30:01
No, you mean you could do it out of one of those keg cups. Solo keg cups, yes.

Carmela: 30:06
Or like a clear, I mean, like this, I feel like the box wines were best made for picnics.

Joe: 30:12
But but like this box wine when it's supposed to be it's elevated, right?

Carmela: 30:16
Yeah. Yeah, for sure. So I still feel like this is a great thing to have outdoors. It's kind of a you know, it I mean it doesn't fit like an indoor, like plop it on the table feeling, you know. But do you think, you know, like I mean on a dinner table. That's what I mean. If you're having a dinner party.

Joe: 30:32
I'm sorry, I've misunderstood you. So you think it's more for outdoors than it is indoors?

Carmela: 30:36
I do.

Joe: 30:36
Okay, okay, gotcha.

Carmela: 30:38
I mean, not to say you can't do that, but I mean you could maybe Thanksgiving have this off to the side. Totally. Or a dinner party. Yeah, but a dinner party, again, I'm just not so sure you want this on the table.

Joe: 30:48
You'd hide it.

Carmela: 30:49
You'd put a bag over it.

Joe: 30:50
No, no, no. It pours out of a spigot, but it's a bottle.

Carmela: 30:55
And you put it in the bottle.

Joe: 30:57
That's a great idea. Actually, I'd love to do that. That would be you know, did it? That would be weird.

Carmela: 31:01
Okay.

Joe: 31:02
I am getting just like a touch of vanilla or something or oak. I wonder if it's oaked. I wonder if it's oaked. We don't know, right? We don't because it won't tell us. Okay. Okay, let's taste it and see what we think. Okay. It's um it's kind of thin. It's bitter though, at the end. Bitter. I feel like it's a little more peach than anything.

Carmela: 31:20
Maybe even like grapefruit. You know, there's a just a little bit of that that really bitter ending of a grapefruit on it to me.

Joe: 31:29
It doesn't have that like really crispy acidity that I want from a Sauvignon Blanc, and it's not as fruity. It does have a lot of bitterness, you know it right? It reminds me of tea. Oh, yeah. Which makes me again wonder did they oak it?

Carmela: 31:42
And we may never know.

Joe: 31:43
We may never know. It it has an oaky taste to me. And I again, that's more California style than than it is. And I'm making this up, I don't know if it is, but it does taste that way to me. What else are you tasting?

Carmela: 31:56
Ooh, well, again, I still think it's very lemony. I think it's pithy.

Joe: 32:00
See, I don't think it's super like it's pithy, and it's got a little lemon, but it's not sharply acidic like I would expect. It's not crisp and fresh.

Carmela: 32:11
No, I wouldn't say it's like refreshing.

Joe: 32:14
No, I agree.

Carmela: 32:15
Like it's kind of heavy, actually.

Joe: 32:17
I think it's got a bigger mouth.

Carmela: 32:18
I do think there's I feel like you're right that there's some sort of oak on this. I think there is. It almost has Chardonnay qualities to me.

Joe: 32:25
Yeah, or they or they macerated it. That sounds dirty, but they left it on the skins for a while, which might be why it's a little darker. I don't know. Well, let's talk about food that we'd pair with this Juliet Samyon Blonde.

Carmela: 32:36
What do you think?

Joe: 32:38
It's almost like a sandwich. I feel like I want a ham sandwich with it.

Carmela: 32:42
Oh, okay. Yeah.

Joe: 32:43
Just like a deli ham. Like maybe it went to 7-Eleven and you just got a ham sandwich.

Carmela: 32:48
Okay. You know? Yep. Yep.

Joe: 32:50
Or like, you know what'd be good?

Carmela: 32:52
Maybe like an egg salad sandwich. That's what I was gonna say.

Joe: 32:55
Yeah, I was in Tokyo about a month ago, and I had some egg salads. I must have had an egg salad sando twice a day. I love those things from 7-Eleven. And that would go great with this.

Carmela: 33:05
That would be a fritata would be good with this. Eggs. You're liking the eggs. I don't know why.

Joe: 33:10
Maybe because it smells a little bit eggy. Well, it's something.

Carmela: 33:13
Well, no, but like eggs are kind of creamy.

Joe: 33:16
Yeah.

Carmela: 33:16
You know, and I think for some reason this would pair well with it.

Joe: 33:20
Deviled eggs. Deviled eggs might be really good with deviled eggs. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. We're not going to be able to do that.

Carmela: 33:25
I want to hear like what people say about deviled eggs. Yeah, well, tell us. There's a lot of things we're coming back. Yeah.

Joe: 33:30
Well, not just kinda. They're like super coming back. But like there's a lot of things we want to hear from you on people. Right. Don't be afraid. We we will respond to you. We'll let you know. We'll let you know that we heard what you said.

Carmela: 33:42
So, you know, also I do think you could do like a white pizza.

Joe: 33:45
Yeah.

Carmela: 33:45
We could do pesto with this.

Joe: 33:47
See, we're thinking more starchy stuff.

Carmela: 33:49
Yeah, starchy, garlicky would be good.

Joe: 33:52
Heavier, a little heavier.

Carmela: 33:53
Like garlic bread would be good.

Joe: 33:54
Like, I don't know that I'd do sushi. I don't know that I'd do fish. Maybe fish and chips. But like, I don't know. Maybe french fries. Maybe I'd do french fries with this. Oh, french fries would be actually really good. Like starchy. Again, starchy.

Carmela: 34:07
Like a fish sandwich would be very good. Fish, fish and chips, like you said. A fish witch. A fish wish. A McDonald's fish witch would pair beautifully with this. Oh, wait. No, it can be a fish witch. What do you guys call it? Another one.

Joe: 34:22
Again, please get back to us. Let's rate this wine. As a reminder, on a rating scale, we rate on a scale of one to ten. We don't give half points. Seven and above means we're gonna buy it. Four or below means we're gonna pour it down the sink. Five or six means we drink it. We finish it. We're not gonna buy it though. What rating are you gonna give this wine?

Carmela: 34:38
Okay, Joe, you gotta help me with this because the deal is You like the packaging. Yeah, I would buy this wine.

Joe: 34:43
For the packaging.

Carmela: 34:44
For the packaging. You'd be like, girl. Then I would pull up that pouch and I'd put my Ziploc in there with other wine. Oh. Not to say I don't like I can't stand the wine. I just, I mean, I would I wish it I wish I liked the wine more.

Joe: 34:59
Yeah, I wish the wine held up to the packaging.

Carmela: 35:01
Yes. So I would buy this for the right person too.

Joe: 35:04
Okay, but what would you okay? So I'm gonna allow you to have two ratings. Rate the wine and then rate the packaging.

Carmela: 35:10
So packaging, I'm giving it a 10.

Joe: 35:12
Wow, you like the packaging.

Carmela: 35:14
It's just so fun. Anybody, I don't know, maybe a lot of people are doing this. Maybe I need to actually look around. But this is fun.

Joe: 35:21
And it's kind of like a drum when you hit it too.

Carmela: 35:23
Do you like me making this sound? Yeah. This could be a kid's toy, don't you? Join the band. Yeah.

Joe: 35:27
I like it.

Carmela: 35:28
You could put toys in here and take it with you.

Joe: 35:31
You guys, what do you think? Would you put toys cold in the bar?

Carmela: 35:34
It's really cute. So I really do like the packaging. I'm giving it a 10. The wine I'm giving it like a five.

Joe: 35:41
Yeah, that's where I am. The wine is a five to me. It's it is inoffensive. It's not, it's on the verge of being offensive. It's not very good. It's pretty thin, even though it's got some weight on it. Doesn't really taste that much like a Sauvignon Blanc. It's a little bit, it's a little bit maybe oaky or there's something going on that I'm not quite loving. But you know what? We wouldn't pour it down the sink.

Carmela: 36:03
No. But and I would finish it. Like I would finish it. I mean, I would.

Joe: 36:06
Would you, would you on a random Tuesday night, if it was in the fridge, would you give it a little, like just a little, like I'm gonna have a little sip.

Carmela: 36:12
Sure. Although this, this sometimes this type of wine, this tasting will give me a little bit of a stomachache.

Joe: 36:18
Oh, well, then don't don't do that because I don't want you to be sick.

Carmela: 36:21
Yeah, no, me neither. But again, it is it's definitely like you can see the effort in this and the design in the packaging. Yeah, in the packaging. And you can tell that these people are pros when it comes to that.

Joe: 36:32
Agree. I wish they did a little bit more work on the wine itself. But anyway, so we both gave it a the wine a five. All right, we're gonna take a break and we're gonna try our second wine.

unknown: 36:41
Okay.

Joe: 36:45
All right, we're back and we're ready to try our second wine. This is the Juliet Pinot Noir. It's from Edna Valley, California. Also a 2022 vintage. Again, $35 for the equivalent of two bottles. We got it at the Juliet website. It's 14.7% alcohol, so pretty high for a Pinot Noir. No professional ratings that we could find. Let's talk about the packaging again.

Carmela: 37:06
Beautiful.

Joe: 37:06
Yeah.

Carmela: 37:07
Yeah. I mean, funny enough, this is more masculine. For I mean, that's weird. I'm just saying the color is kind of. Yeah, so you could give this as a gift to a dude. I mean, whatever that means, I don't know. But if we're talking about that, you could just you could, you know. Yeah. This could be part of somebody's fit.

Joe: 37:25
And they use the packaging well. Like on the if you turn it around, better taste, less waste. They talk about it being vegan and no this and no that. So they're getting all the notes that people care about that this that this wine is made for.

Carmela: 37:36
Well, and the other thing is when you have a container like this, you sorry.

Joe: 37:41
Also, I lied. This is the 2023. I'm looking at it right now. It's the 2023 Pinot Noir. Sorry.

Carmela: 37:46
No, so if you have a container like this, you have to use the space because it's not just like a label on the front and label on the back. You got to use the space well. And I think they do. Yeah. There's a bunch of information.

Joe: 37:59
No, it's well look, they put a ton of time into this, a ton of thought into it. So you cannot fault them on that. That they've done very well there. Okay, let's talk about the color of the wine.

Carmela: 38:10
I don't know about you, but mine looks kind of cloudy.

Joe: 38:12
It's a little cloudy. It's very dark.

Carmela: 38:14
It's like it's not filtered, but I'm sure it is. It just looks like it's not. It's very dark, but it's kind of matte. Like it's not a shiny.

Joe: 38:24
Good call. Don't you think? It's not, it's yes. Sometimes these are like they have this like translucence or something about them. This radiance. Exactly.

Carmela: 38:32
This almost looks like grape juice.

Joe: 38:34
It very much does. And it does not look like a Pinot Noir. When I poured it, I'm like, No. This doesn't look like a Pinot Noir to me.

Carmela: 38:41
No.

Joe: 38:41
Or it looks like a California Pinot Noir. Like an overly ripe one. Okay, let's smell it and see what we think.

unknown: 38:46
Okay.

Joe: 38:47
And that's the way it smells. It smells like raisins. Smells like raisins. You know what?

Carmela: 38:51
I was gonna say currants, um, molasses.

Joe: 38:55
Dried cranberry.

Carmela: 38:56
Mm-hmm. Raisins, though, that's a good one. Raisin, yeah, dried rain. Yeah, it's a dried fruit.

Joe: 39:01
If I if I swirl it, I am getting a little bit of smoke and a little bit of like maybe a little bit of rosemary, a little bit of like herb on it, a little rosemary.

Carmela: 39:11
Okay.

Joe: 39:12
But more like a smoke. Maybe I I think this is oaked as well. I might be getting a little cigar box, you know, like a little box, a little wood.

Carmela: 39:21
It's a little musty, you know, but not like basement musty, but just sort of musky.

Joe: 39:26
Maybe what did I say? Yeah. No, no, no.

Carmela: 39:29
No, you're right, more musky.

Joe: 39:30
But it is kind of grapey. Don't you think it's grapey?

Carmela: 39:33
Mm-hmm.

Joe: 39:33
It's grapey. Maple thinks so.

Carmela: 39:35
But it's kind of it's almost like syrupy too. You know, like a little bit, there's a hint of sweetness on it too. Like I said, it's kind of uh smelling a little bit like molasses.

Joe: 39:44
Yeah. It's it's got a little spice to me on it. It almost smells like a Syrah to me. But I'm thinking like a spicy cherry, like a spicy cherry.

Carmela: 39:53
Or like a mold wine.

Joe: 39:55
A mold wine. A mold wine.

Carmela: 39:56
Oh, I think, yeah.

Joe: 39:58
And Mabel agrees.

Carmela: 40:00
Yeah, she's fully on board.

Joe: 40:01
All right. I think we should taste it and see what we think. Okay. I'm not quite sure what to make of it.

Carmela: 40:07
It's funny because it has kind of a when you first put it in your mouth, uh uh, tastes kind of big, but it's pretty thin.

Joe: 40:14
Yeah.

Carmela: 40:14
Like there's not a lot of before, like beginning, middle, end.

Joe: 40:18
Yeah.

Carmela: 40:19
This is not telling us a story here.

Joe: 40:21
No. I I also don't feel like it tastes like wine. It tastes like a cocktail to me. It tastes like a grape cocktail.

Carmela: 40:28
Like a grape knee high. Yeah. Do you remember that drink, anybody? Oh gosh. Oh, another thing. Just let us know anything that's on your mind. How about that? No, but do you remember we were we wanted our son to order?

Joe: 40:40
Because he doesn't really like alcohol, and we were like, let's make it.

Carmela: 40:42
Not that we're trying to encourage him. Yes, we are.

Joe: 40:44
We're trying to encourage him, and he couldn't find and he tried a grape knee high. No, no, no. No, no, he wanted to try a grape knee high. We went to a restaurant and they were like, What in the hell are you talking about?

Carmela: 40:52
And then we really felt old. Then we were like, wow, you don't know what a grape knee high is. So maybe nobody out there knows. I don't even know what was in it. But anyway, it has a hint of that.

Joe: 41:02
It tastes like a liqueur to me. Okay. That's what it tastes. It tastes like a cherry liqueur, but a thin one. Like it had been watered down. Like somebody went in and we're like, I don't want mom and dad to know that I've been drinking their cherry liqueur. That's totally what it tastes like.

Carmela: 41:15
Yeah.

Joe: 41:15
And it's been watered down. It tastes like cough syrup.

Carmela: 41:18
Cough syrup, cherry cordial.

Joe: 41:20
Yeah. But not a nice one, like a cheap one.

Carmela: 41:22
Kind of like an old one. Yeah. Like you're in your grandma's, you know, old box of cherry cordial. So you're like, yum.

Joe: 41:30
Go to your grandparents or your parents, depending on how old they are, and look in their liquor cabinet and see if there's an old, like, you know, an old liqueur in there. Some old brandy or Kersh or something. And like, because it is a little musty tasting. Now that you say musty, I'm like, it tastes a little musty.

Carmela: 41:47
Yeah. But like I said, it's it's so interesting because it doesn't there's no beginning, middle, and you know sometimes you have that front of mouth, back of mouth. Totally right. It's just like a one note kind of an unusual. Do you think the plastic bag does anything to the wine? Like, does it play into how it tastes?

Joe: 42:06
Now, in theory, no, because they're supposed to be neutral, they're supposed to be uh create like a neutral taste or not have a taste exactly. Okay. So they they do carefully make them so that they're Mabel is eating our wires again. So they're supposed to be neutral. So, but but that being said, oh god, she's got my headphone. Sissy. Hold on. I was so distracted, I can't remember what I was talking about. But but I do like it's super, it's almost like plum pudding or something, like a plum jam or well, and it actually looks plummy. Yeah, it does. To me, it does not taste like a pinot noir at all. Like if it has any cherry flavor, again, it's like cherry cough syrup. What what food would you pair with this Juliet Pinot Noir?

Carmela: 42:50
Well, I think you need to eat with it.

Joe: 42:52
Oh, yeah. Like something heavy.

Carmela: 42:54
Yeah. Putinesca. Something salty, something with capers and olives and yeah.

Joe: 43:02
And squid ink. Ooh. Like something real fishy.

Carmela: 43:06
No.

Joe: 43:06
Yeah.

Carmela: 43:07
But no, I yeah, I think something, or even like a beef, like stro not stroganoff. Well, maybe something rich.

Joe: 43:13
Smoke sausage.

Carmela: 43:14
Something rich.

Joe: 43:15
Real smoky foods.

Carmela: 43:17
A baked zitti. Our son makes baked zitis all the time. That's what would be good with it, too.

Joe: 43:22
Yeah, maybe like barbecued ribs or something. Like something real saucy. Yeah. Like heavy, saucy. Saucy, salty. All right, Carmela. Let's rate it. Let's be honest here.

Carmela: 43:31
Well, I'm telling you, again, packaging is 10. I love it. I'm just disappointed. I wouldn't buy this one for anybody. The other one I have people in mind that I I don't have anybody in mind for this.

Joe: 43:42
In fact, we were talking about like for your cousin, you'd buy the Chardonnay version of it.

Carmela: 43:46
Yeah, I think she'd love it. Like she would perfect. Yeah. I think she'd probably like the wine and exactly. Would um she would love the packaging. So it's already on my radar.

Joe: 43:55
But let's rate this wine.

Carmela: 43:56
Oh, I'm giving it, I don't even know if I can I would finish it. I'm cheating. Tetering, tottering, teeter, tottering between a four and a five. Four.

Joe: 44:04
I'm gonna go four as well. It's just I wouldn't it's between a four and a five. I'm with you. It's between a four and a five. It is not like the most horrible one. It's not horrible. It's not horrible.

Carmela: 44:12
I just don't know if I'm gonna waste a glass of wine on this. Yeah.

Joe: 44:16
It's disappointing to me, is what it is, because it doesn't judging if as a Pinot Noir, it's definitely a four. As an overall wine, like we've had worse wines for sure. For sure. But I just like it's it's a four. It's a four. I'm sorry. I wish we could.

Carmela: 44:31
People are not wanting to invest in this bo in a box wine. They can't. I mean, we don't know much about the winemaker, right?

Joe: 44:37
No, we don't know anything. I didn't like about it.

Carmela: 44:39
It's not like they're gonna be able, like, if they were starting to make like partner with winemakers that made great wine, nobody probably wants to do that.

Joe: 44:47
That's kind of my point. That was kind of the point I was trying to make. It makes me a little sus susp sus or skep when you have an expensive wine and they're not telling you anything about the way the wine is made. Anything about the winemaker. I mean, Costco tells you who the winemaker is half the time. Yeah. And and I just don't like that.

Carmela: 45:04
I think because people are just not buying into it. The winemakers are not buying into it.

Joe: 45:09
Well, the other thing is I don't think the people who are buying this care that much about the wine. I think they care about the packaging.

Carmela: 45:14
The thing that's too bad, though, is it just doesn't taste very good.

Joe: 45:17
That's what I'm saying. I agree with you. Okay, which one of these are you finishing tonight?

Carmela: 45:20
I'll I'll do the Sauvignon Blanc.

Joe: 45:22
I agree, but like by a hair. Oh, yeah.

Carmela: 45:24
I'm not really sure we're gonna keep it around.

Joe: 45:27
Yeah, which is the one.

Carmela: 45:29
You know, something to do, something that we can use these boxes for. I like it. Drums.

Joe: 45:33
All right, let's talk about the taste profiles expected from a Juliet Sauvignon Blanc and Pinot Noir. Okay. The winery just says this about the Sauvignon Blanc. Meyer lemon, ripe pear, honeydew melon. I think you got pear and lemon. And then food and wine said floral and lemony. Whatever. I don't, you know, there isn't a lot. Okay, and for the Pinot Noir, the winery says red cherry raspberry baking spice. I think it's raspberry, maybe a little baking spice. The wine enthusiasts from the 2021 vintage. So it could be totally different because the 2023. Subtle aromas of plummy fruits, yes. Toasted bread. Uh lead from the nose into the palate, where simple red fruits are laced with graham cracker warmth.

unknown: 46:13
Oh.

Joe: 46:13
That's not that bad. Graham cracker. I think that I could almost get graham cracker out of it, but not what I want from a Pinot Noir. Okay.

Carmela: 46:19
No.

Joe: 46:20
So what's your verdict on Juliet Boxed Wine? I know exactly what you're gonna say.

Carmela: 46:24
Again, I mean, I wish I could love the wine.

Joe: 46:26
You love the packaging.

Carmela: 46:28
I think the packaging's super cool, and I wouldn't want to have my wine in that package all the time. But I think every once in a while it's a great gift, it's a cool look.

Joe: 46:37
Sometimes she wants to look at your wine package. Oh.

Carmela: 46:40
That's a terrible conversation.

Joe: 46:42
I feel the same way. I think you're right, and I I I wish I couldn't hear you. But um, I I I think you're exactly right. Like they did what they meant to do, which is they built beautiful packaging, great packaging, wonderful PR. They've done a beautiful job with the wine packaging and the idea and everything. They just haven't hit the wine yet. And I wish they would. No. And now it's time to head over to our news desk so that we can cover our wine in the news this week segment. And Carmela, this actually, this story was related to something that you and Mikey, who's our youngest son, were talking about earlier.

Carmela: 47:17
Oh, really?

Joe: 47:21
Wine in the news this week. Our wine in the news this week comes from James Bailey, writing for the drinks business. And the article is called Top Ten Wine Related Baby Names.

Carmela: 47:35
No.

Joe: 47:35
Weren't you guys talking about baby names? Yeah, we just were. Yeah. I have to say, after two weeks of in a row of Italian wine thefts, I think it's time to do something a little lighter. Exactly. The links to this article and all the articles we use for research are in the show notes, as always. So here's the scoop. The folks at the drinks business went through the government records of every baby name registered in England and Wales from 1996 to 2025, about 40,000 different names, and they pulled out the ones that looked like they were inspired by wine.

unknown: 48:04
Oh.

Joe: 48:04
So any guesses on the top names? Top ten. We're gonna do top names.

Carmela: 48:08
Names inspired by wines?

Joe: 48:10
Yeah.

Carmela: 48:10
I think you just need to. I mean I'm I'm I'm racing.

Joe: 48:12
You're gonna when you hear some, you're gonna be like, oh yeah, obviously. Okay, number one, Margot. M-A-G-A-U-X. Uh-huh. Number two, believe it or not, is Chardonnay.

Carmela: 48:21
No.

Joe: 48:22
Yes, there are six different spellings for it, but Chardonnay. Number three, Sherry.

Carmela: 48:26
Okay, of course. Chardonnay.

Joe: 48:28
Number four will surprise you, Chira's.

Carmela: 48:31
Wow.

Joe: 48:31
I know. Evidently it's a boy's name. Number five is Tawny, like port, tawny part.

Carmela: 48:38
Right, right.

Joe: 48:39
Number six, crystal with an eye. Crystal.

Carmela: 48:42
Yeah, I like that one.

Joe: 48:43
Number seven, related to number four, Syrah. Number eight, Tuscany.

Carmela: 48:47
No, this is too much.

Joe: 48:48
That's a little bit of a stretch, too, because Tuscany isn't a wine.

Carmela: 48:51
This is cracking me up.

Joe: 48:52
Number nine is Petru. Okay. And number ten, there was a tie. I'm not kidding. A tie between Champagne, Dionysus, Mimosa, Morgon, and Rioja.

Carmela: 49:04
Nope, I wouldn't name, I mean, that's not okay. I mean, okay, look. Okay, wait, wait. Wait, wait, wait.

Joe: 49:13
That's right. So it's okay. Don't yuck your yum. No, never. They left out Rose because maybe it's Rose, but they they said that's probably with the flower, right? Right. And they also left out Brandy because it's a spirit, not really a wine.

Carmela: 49:25
Oh, and Brandy I can get behind. So I guess it's a few.

Joe: 49:29
Okay. Right. Here's the question for you. If we were to name one of our children after a wine, what would it be? Probably Juliet. But what would it be?

Carmela: 49:38
Oh, I don't know. We wouldn't.

Joe: 49:40
Okay, but if you had to. We we we haven't named our children.

Carmela: 49:43
We already have named our children.

Joe: 49:45
But are there any wine or Mabel? Were there any wine names that came up? I don't think so.

Carmela: 49:49
I like Rose.

Joe: 49:51
I like Rose or Rose.

Carmela: 49:52
We have a we have a Mariana Rose. We do. So there you go.

Joe: 49:55
There you go. Okay. Uh just on a side note, too, on our wine and the news article from last week, more news has come out that the alarms were turned off from inside the building the day before the robbery.

unknown: 50:07
Oh God.

Carmela: 50:08
It's got to be an inside job. Yeah, that's crazy. Good information to know.

Joe: 50:12
I know. Terrible. All right, some listener shout outs. Janine said that her she and her husband wanted a glass of wine with dinner, and the dinner was Ethiopian chicken. And so she looked up what wine to pair with that. And guess what the AI responded with? They talked about a podcast called the Wine Pear Podcast to give ideas about what to pair it with.

Carmela: 50:33
So I was like, That's right.

Joe: 50:35
So and she said, I'm sure you've been generously compensated for that. And it's like, no, no, she was joking. Okay. Chef Paul reached out, he asked us if we've ever done Nero di Troyoa, which is actually a grape and a wine from Puglia. And I don't remember seeing it there. Yeah. So Chef Paul, we're on the lookout for it. And then Doug wrote us and he suggested we do some more reasonably priced Willamette Pinot Noir.

Carmela: 50:58
Okay.

Joe: 50:59
That's a good idea. We're going down to Pinot Noir, Willamette Pinot Noir Country over the weekend. But we've got that on the list too. We haven't done that for a little while. Some wines coming up in future episodes in case you want to drink along with us. We're going to do Urba Luce. And again, we've got the specific wines, links to them, the years, all that kind of stuff, the vintages, all that kind of stuff. We're going to do Limou Cremant. We're going to do Cote d'Arone. We're going to do Burgundy Cremant. We're going to do Mandayuse. And we're also going to do Grillo. Grillo, which is another Italian white wine. But Carmela, that's it. So thank you for listening to us and for supporting our show. And remember, we buy all of our own wine. We do all the writing and recording and editing to bring you a show every week. And we maybe we should do better editing because we absolutely love doing it. And our small little ask is that you please follow or subscribe to our podcast. And also please leave us a nice five-star rating and review to help us grow our listeners. And again, a huge thanks to everybody who takes the time to do that. We really appreciate it. You can follow us on Instagram and Blue Sky and TikTok at the WinePair Podcast. You can contact us on our website, thewinepairpodcast.com, sign up for our email newsletter there, shop our shop wine section where you can find wines that we rate as buys in every episode. And we also love to make content that you care about and you like. So send us a note or DM us, give us some feedback. Let us know if there's we asked a lot of questions today.

Carmela: 52:17
I mean kind of too many.

Joe: 52:19
Yeah, so let us know the answers to any of them at Joe at the WinePair Podcast.com. But with that, we're gonna sign off. So thank you once again. We'll see you next time. And as we like to stay live at short, stop clicky chitty white. Bye-bye.